A green and clean environment is a human right!
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: johnd on October 13, 2010, 17:24:19 pm
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Hello , im trying to find out how much gas you can get from 1litre of water . I read it somewhere a while ago but cant find it . Anyone know ?
Cheers
John
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20°C, 1atm pressure:
2024 cm³/g = 2024liters gas per kilogram/liter water.
molar mass water: 18.05 g/mol
=> 55.4 mol/kg
1 mol water -> 1.5 mol H2 + O2
universal gas law: 1.5 * 55.4 * 8.314 * 293 / 105 m3 = 2.024 m3 = 2024 l
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in my numbers i have 1847 liters stp
if you calculate this from 22,4 liters per mole of gas as 1 liter of water will liberate 55,51 moles of H2 and 27,755 moles of O2 you have 83,265 * 22,4 = 1865 liters at stp
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1 liter = 1 kg H20 = 1000 g H2O (because Density of Water = 1000 g/liter)
H = 1.01 g/mole (from periodic table)
O = 16.00 g/mole (from periodic table) (mol or mole is just a number, or quantity, if you wanted to count all the atoms that make a gram)
H2O = 18.02 g/mol
1000 g H2O / 18.02 g/mol = 55.5 moles of H20
H2O ---> (1/2)O2 + H2 [balanced chemical equation, excluding energy input]
55.5 ---> (1/2)55.5 + 55.5 [moles]
1000 g ---> 27.7 moles*32.00 g/mole + 55.5 moles*2.02 g/mole [grams]
Thus...
1000 g H2O ---> 886.4 g O2 + 112.1 g H2 (rounded)
if you did this calculation for gasoline, then you would find water has about 2.5x the amount of hydrogen (by mass or volume, i am not sure, because 1 liter of gasoline does not have the same mass as 1 liter of water, gasoline is lighter than water) ... meaning [1000 g *?or?* 1 liter] of gasoline has 44.84 grams of Hydrogen
so we have the mass of the gas from the separated water, if you want volume you have to know the density
Volume = Mass / Density
your density depends on pressure, I don't have the figures for that
A rough figure I know of is that it expands 1860 times when separated, so 1 liter of water = 1860 liters of gas, i think at 1 atm pressure
if your cell has a fixed volume, then density will increase with pressure
the exact calculations ca be done, you just have to get the right figures to start with and determine exactly what your situation is, for what you want to find out
provide more information on your question and i can look up some more exact values and try and do the exact calculations...
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haithar, universal gas law only applies if a hydrogen and oxygen and air gas mixture is considered an ideal gas
is it an ideal gas? i never ventured to determine if it was or not, yet...
some experiments could be done to compare it to steam, or air, and we have all the values from the steam tables and air tables, in the back of any thermodynamics textbook, they may be close but so far i think they will be slightly different
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Many thanks for the reply's . Im off on holiday tomorrow , but when i come back im going to have a go at replicating scott cramtons cell . Apparantly he is getting 6lpm @1 amp pulsing an alternator . Its constructed the same as meyers demo cell with the slots to make the tube pairs resonate .
If i can generate 6lpm it should be enough to run a petrol generator ...... happy days .
There are construction plans on Patric Kelly's site if anyone is interested . The site is well worth looking at if you have an interest in free energy :
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/ (http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/)
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Chapter10.pdf (http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Chapter10.pdf) scott cramton design starts on page 39
John
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Many thanks for the reply's . Im off on holiday tomorrow , but when i come back im going to have a go at replicating scott cramtons cell . Apparantly he is getting 6lpm @1 amp pulsing an alternator . Its constructed the same as meyers demo cell with the slots to make the tube pairs resonate .
If i can generate 6lpm it should be enough to run a petrol generator ...... happy days .
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haithar, universal gas law only applies if a hydrogen and oxygen and air gas mixture is considered an ideal gas
is it an ideal gas? i never ventured to determine if it was or not, yet...
some experiments could be done to compare it to steam, or air, and we have all the values from the steam tables and air tables, in the back of any thermodynamics textbook, they may be close but so far i think they will be slightly different
the results are more or less accurate nevertheless and i'd think better than "A rough figure I know" ;)
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You may want to take into account the energy required to turn the alternator in your energy in side of your equation
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In terms of thermal explosive energy-yield (gtnt) under dynamic pressure of compression
approximately 7.4 (µl) microliter of a liquid-volume of a water droplet per injection cycle is all that ~s
required to run the Dune Buggy 1600cc 50hp VW I.C. engine at 65 m.p.h. on the open road; whereas,
a typical 325 hp diesel I.C. truck-engine would require about 48.1 (µl) microliters of a water droplet
per injection cycle to accomplish the same open road performance. (see WFC Water vs Gasoline
Energy Content Equations (memo WFC 429).
How much LPM water is this for the typical diesel truck?
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48 uL per power stroke... lets round to 50 uL
1/4 cycles are power stokes
say 2000 rpm? ... then ...
500 power strokes per minutes
50 uL * 500 power strokes /min = 25,000 uL/minute
= 25 mL/minute, or you could say
40 minutes per liter...
thats the basic idea, change the numbers to match your rpm and engine (2 stroke or 4 stroke)
The above number, 50 uL per injection cycle, is based on the hydrogen content of water being 2.5x gasoline, you can see this calcuation done out in full in the independent report, it's not a magic calculation that has anything to do with the WFC tech, so it's the same as saying a diesel engine uses 20 uL per injection cycle of Diesel fuel... which would vary depending on your engine
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Thanks.
Now let's hope the water doesn't get consumed, or else we'll face a different problem ;) .
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If the water does get consumed, like in the Hydrogen Fracturing Process, then this releases more energy than 2.5x gasoline.... Stan says the HFP gives 2,500,000 barrels of oil worth of energy for 1 gallon of water, this is if you completely destroy it to release the mas energy.
With the HFP you would power the WHOLE WORLD with 34 gallons of water a day (being destroyed... approx)