Author Topic: Back to Basics  (Read 16095 times)

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2023, 12:58:27 pm »
The only way I see to reduce the current is to purify water… but than no electrolysis happens!

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #41 on: March 10, 2023, 14:11:46 pm »
The only way I see to reduce the current is to purify water… but than no electrolysis happens!

Even if the water if purified, the current voltage relationship will be positive linear, increasing voltage will increase current (much less current, of course because purified water has higher impedance).

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #42 on: March 10, 2023, 17:49:20 pm »
Well supposedly when resonance is reached in the cavity according to Meyer there is a kind effect on the current flow… the question is what resonance he was talking about? In that patent he talked about matching the wavelength of the movement of the ions or something very close to that…

If the resonance is in the audio range than it may not be so hard to get it ringing…

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #43 on: March 10, 2023, 23:24:50 pm »
Yes, I agree. Duty Cycle Pulses were Stan's method of controlling this sustained polarization and bursting amplitudes.

Also, most people never realize the great inhibition on tuning pulses and core saturation, that a percentage based duty cycle adjustment causes. All your signal generators are flawed, making it nearly impossible to tune replications of Stan's circuits due to all the differences in the VIC Matrix caused by parasitics and ideal vs real component behaviors.

Only having independent width and spacing control circumvents this flaw. I'm writing an article on my research on this subject that I will share sometime soon. :)

I dont know. Stan has the 7490 I.C in the circuit. this chip divides frequency and outputs a 50-50 duty cycle, so he never adjusted duty cycle in the high frequency signal, he only adjusts the gate (low freq signal) pulse and width. In the images where the primary signal is round and stretched is the result of transformer action only, not electronics.

So far, I never saw someone increasing the voltage at the cell with decreasing current at the same time. More voltage = morre current, always, thats ohms law. If you apply a HV pulse, current will flow based on the cell resistance.

The high voltage pulse is temporary.  It's only there to break the water after it's already been charged by the low voltage pulses.  Since the water is already near the breaking point, the high voltage pulse is just the straw to break the camel's back as it were.

This is why you can accomplish this effect even by feeding only 2V into the VIC primary.

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #44 on: March 11, 2023, 15:09:05 pm »
Well supposedly when resonance is reached in the cavity according to Meyer there is a kind effect on the current flow… the question is what resonance he was talking about? In that patent he talked about matching the wavelength of the movement of the ions or something very close to that…

If the resonance is in the audio range than it may not be so hard to get it ringing…

If we look at the flat vic core, matching the wavelenght makes more sense. The flat core VIC has aprox 750m of wire. Assuming he used quarterwave length, the fundamental freq has a 750mx4 = 3000m. 3000m is the wavelength of a 100khz signal assuming an air core. With a ferrite in the middle the inductance increases and the fundamental will lower a little bit.

Seems more plausible. I had the flat vic transformer with the identical core and windings but no sucess in achieving resonance. The only difference is that I didnt have 10 cells in series, apart from the fact that Stan probably wire the 10 VIC transformers in series to drive the 10 series tubes.

If he had 10 vic transformers in series, 100khz fundamental would drop to 10khz just like he said in his patents and yes, the transformers works in series and it is a very common stuff in some high voltage circuits like co2 laser cutter power supplies.

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #45 on: March 11, 2023, 18:58:43 pm »
I’m not totally sure if the length of the wire is so important… also this long coils resonate at much lower frequency than 100kgz from what I remember from testing.. 

I believe there’s a contradiction between Stan words and what was shown

Meyer talk about bifilar all the time and this Vic’s founded  don’t seem to have any bifilar coil in it….

For me it’s more likely that the epg were the real used Vic than those

When applying a frequency above the self-resonant frequency of the coil supposedly than the signal is transported in the coil by capacitive effect meaning the coil kind of behave some like a capacitor above it’s resonant frequency… and what that mean?

Well it mean that when you apply a voltage to it it gets charged like a capacitor would… a simple coil would reverse its polarity immediately after it’s disconnected however a coilpacitor will be able to discharge the capacitive side of the coil first and only after that get the reversal of polarity… basically energy get consumed since the capacitance charge is opposite polarity to the inductor at the moment just where the current is interrupted…



« Last Edit: March 11, 2023, 20:17:09 pm by sebosfato »

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #46 on: March 14, 2023, 13:58:46 pm »
I’m not totally sure if the length of the wire is so important… also this long coils resonate at much lower frequency than 100kgz from what I remember from testing.. 

I believe there’s a contradiction between Stan words and what was shown

Meyer talk about bifilar all the time and this Vic’s founded  don’t seem to have any bifilar coil in it….

For me it’s more likely that the epg were the real used Vic than those

When applying a frequency above the self-resonant frequency of the coil supposedly than the signal is transported in the coil by capacitive effect meaning the coil kind of behave some like a capacitor above it’s resonant frequency… and what that mean?

Well it mean that when you apply a voltage to it it gets charged like a capacitor would… a simple coil would reverse its polarity immediately after it’s disconnected however a coilpacitor will be able to discharge the capacitive side of the coil first and only after that get the reversal of polarity… basically energy get consumed since the capacitance charge is opposite polarity to the inductor at the moment just where the current is interrupted…

Probably not important. If I remeber correctly the 3 3000 turns coils connected in series resonate at 15-18khz with the thin vic core. With thicker cores I have it goes down to 9-10 khz.

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Re: Back to Basics
« Reply #47 on: March 16, 2023, 22:19:29 pm »
I’m not totally sure if the length of the wire is so important… also this long coils resonate at much lower frequency than 100kgz from what I remember from testing.. 

I believe there’s a contradiction between Stan words and what was shown

Meyer talk about bifilar all the time and this Vic’s founded  don’t seem to have any bifilar coil in it….

For me it’s more likely that the epg were the real used Vic than those

When applying a frequency above the self-resonant frequency of the coil supposedly than the signal is transported in the coil by capacitive effect meaning the coil kind of behave some like a capacitor above it’s resonant frequency… and what that mean?

Well it mean that when you apply a voltage to it it gets charged like a capacitor would… a simple coil would reverse its polarity immediately after it’s disconnected however a coilpacitor will be able to discharge the capacitive side of the coil first and only after that get the reversal of polarity… basically energy get consumed since the capacitance charge is opposite polarity to the inductor at the moment just where the current is interrupted…

Agreed.

The capacitor's dielectric material (in this case, water) and the conductive plates will have some inherent resistance, which is often referred to as equivalent series resistance (ESR). When you take this ESR into account, the capacitor can exhibit RC-like behavior to some extent.