My 8XA circuit

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Dynodon:

My current set up is the five coil variation of stan's with the secondary and primary combined on one bobbin.  I use ferrite for the rectangular core.  This morning I reached 10.2kv ptp at 525hz with my 3 inch cell gapped at .5mm.  Still little gas in RO water.  I'm having fun learning and your comments are welcomed.  I too enjoyed your video.

kb

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 I've had a question about the 8xa for some time now, maybe you guys can answer; just for an example, imagine the 8xa was supplying 100volts and 2 amps to the cell, would the output be the same as 2 amp and 2volts to the cell? What I'm really asking is are you guys producing any gas from this large voltage input? or is this process extremely wasteful?

Ps. I've started on my own version of this set up, what I have noticed is the speed at which the gas streams out of the cell, I've never seen the gas move so fast in any of my electrolysis experiments except if I used a pump to force it out.

Thanks
Dave

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Dave,

100 volts at 2 amps equals 200 watts of power.

2 volts at 2 amps equals 4 watts of power

What do you think?

Don

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Don, it's easy to see that there is a large power difference but it's voltage which should not produce more hho under normal electrolysis. I'm sure you know how average electrolysis works. It's electron transfer. Do you understand what I mean? In electrolysis, electron flow through the circuit is the only thing that matters plus the 1.5 volts it takes. So simply having a high voltage at the same amperage level should not change anything, gas production would be the same, you would just be wasting a lot of power with the extra voltage being applied, unless something else is happening here than just amp flow being restricted.

 2 amps at 100 volts is a lot different than 100 amps at 2 volts when dealing with faraday electrolysis, even though they are the same wattage

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Dave,your first sentence says it all,"under normal electrolysis".We're not trying to do normal electrolysis with high voltage.In order for Stans high voltage to work ,we will need over 1kv-1.5kv.

But no one has been able to prove it yet.

I do know how normal electrolysis works,and yes the extra voltage will only cause the water to heat up.Wasted wattage.But thats not what we're after here.

This 8xa circuit isn't meant to produce very high voltage,only to prove amp restriction.
Don

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yes I understand, what I was asking was for a comparison between the 8xa and average electrolysis output. I wasn't sure if the the 8xa at the voltage most people are achieving had any different affect. Thanks for the clarification

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another interesting thread

the question that comes to mind is:
With electrolyte based electrolysis booster cells, once the required strength of electrolyte was found then the gap between the plates or tubes was then worked on to suit the setup, that way as i have seen when an ideal space was used with a n electrolyte saturated water low voltage and low current provided enough to give some desired efects with fuel economy and emmission reduction whilst the cell stayed cool and clean.

So with the cells being used on the 8xa designs, i am wondering is there an ideal length of tube to be used(also considering plate occlusion) and gap that is ideal for non electrolysis designs that may help with an agreed base to work from so that the characteristics of the cell can be measured and experiments taken from there.?
Am wondering this because if others are winding their own chokes to varying characteristic cells(area of metal and gap and volume of water), there is a thread on the permitivity of water; might it be of use of there is a calculation or agreed dimension of tube set for the purposes of you all being able to obtain a desired result and improve from there?

one more thought; meyers multi tube setup has the electrical connections at the base of the tube set - does that affect the desired effect being sought after and does the conductivity of s/s tubes affect this?

cheers

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All,

I have compared gas output with staight dc from the rectified variac against a square wave pulsed four inch torroid wound 8xa style.  Watt for watt there is little gas production difference between the two at most all frequencies.

I am trying to get to 1.5kv and see very little gas action at 1kv so my experiments continue.  I reach 1kv with a iron wire primary wound over a multi-layer secondary on the same bobbin with the 1.2h chokes arranged as per meyer's vic drawings.  The whole circuit pulls .5 to 1 amp at 12 volts. 

Perhaps this cannot be done at 1.5kv with a cell sitting in pure water but requires a completely insulated tube set up.  My center tube is filled and my outer tube is thickly covered with plumbers goop adhesive.

kb