Author Topic: WFC VIC  (Read 276413 times)

0 Members and 41 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 99
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #256 on: March 14, 2011, 23:18:39 pm »
Ali,the VCC for Stans VIC circuit was 12 volts and VDD was 5 volts.The first two resistors are 220k and the cap is 10uF.
Don

OOPS !
my oversight is acknowledged, thank you sir!
I will make the changes and correct...

as far as the cap on pins 6 & 2 i think 1.0 uf makes more sense because it allows a higher frequency for the scanner to lock the VCO in less time, thereby following resonance more closely
Any opinions from anyone else on this?

@Don... ? are the photos you post allowed to be shared with others on the net or do you frown on sharing this stuff ?
thanks for all you did and are doing... our country needs to be free from Oil Addiction ASAP !

EDIT:
fixed the VCC issue
went back to the original 10VDC at the top of the resistor dividers for pin 3 of the LM741 on fig 8 as well, the result was a sawtooth wave with a peak of about 5 volts and a valley of about 2.5 volts. I hope this is what we need for the VCO input on pin 9 of the 4046

see images below regarding the 555 timing
with the scope set at 1 second per division horizontally the difference is very noticeable
I vote for the 1.0uf cap for a closer tracking of the WFC resonance
the 10uf takes too long to charge resulting in a huge delay...
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 00:35:32 am by ali »

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 460
    • Global Kast : Water Fuel Cell Research
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #257 on: March 14, 2011, 23:24:53 pm »
That capacitor is a polarized 10uF, the scan time is set to 0.219 Hz. Also here's how you decode the precision resistors that Stan used.

(http://www.globalkast.com/images/tonywoodside/res_prec.gif)

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 363
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #258 on: March 15, 2011, 00:14:38 am »
Ali,I don't care if you post my pics anywhere else.They'll get around sooner or later.
Don

Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 99
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #259 on: March 15, 2011, 00:37:36 am »
Ali,I don't care if you post my pics anywhere else.They'll get around sooner or later.
Don

Here is a photoshop edit of the VIC card to help with figuring out the backside...

Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 99
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #260 on: March 15, 2011, 00:43:18 am »
That capacitor is a polarized 10uF, the scan time is set to 0.219 Hz.


May i ask if we are speaking of the same component? im looking at the dark blue electrolytic to the right of the 555, the glare does not allow us to determine exactly if it's a 1.0 or a 10 u... how did you get that value for the scan time?
My multisim scope shots in a previous post show a very slow scan time with a 10u
please help?
im confused
can the resonance afford to wait over a few seconds to readjust the lock in?

Thanks for your posts and your excellent web site!

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 460
    • Global Kast : Water Fuel Cell Research
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #261 on: March 15, 2011, 01:17:11 am »
Yes sir, Thats the cap Im talking about also. if you close you can see that its a 10uF 25v polarized cap. The scanning circuit has an on-time of 3 sec. and an off-time of 1.5 sec. this will cause a modulation of the frequency and coincides with what Puharich says about the voltage modulation of 3 sec. or 0.125 Hz - 0.250 Hz, which is the Nuclear Magnetic Relaxation time of the water molecule. The 1.5 sec. off-time allows the water molecule to recover. Heres what i have together as of right now, one photo has the component values and the other has the bottom traces overlaying the component side of the board.

(http://www.globalkast.com/images/stanmeyer/VIC_Card_values.PNG)

(http://www.globalkast.com/images/stanmeyer/VIC_Card_com-side_with_Trace.PNG)

Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 99
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #262 on: March 15, 2011, 01:30:23 am »
Yes sir, Thats the cap Im talking about also. if you close you can see that its a 10uF 25v polarized cap. The scanning circuit has an on-time of 3 sec. and an off-time of 1.5 sec. this will cause a modulation of the frequency and coincides with what Puharich says about the voltage modulation of 3 sec. or 0.125 Hz - 0.250 Hz, which is the Nuclear Magnetic Relaxation time of the water molecule. The 1.5 sec. off-time allows the water molecule to recover. Heres what i have together as of right now, one photo has the component values and the other has the bottom traces overlaying the component side of the board.




i thought the scanning time was required to be very fast so that the PLL could find the resonant frequency that gives lowest amps and that frequency was related to a range of frequencies between 1 and 10 khz, therefore the VCO (voltage controlled oscillator) needed a range of voltages to scan for a lock frequency, this is why the waveform from the scanning circuit has a ramp voltage from 2.5 volts to 5 volts and then back again until the PLL locks, it should happen as fast as possible because the cell may go out of resonance within 1/2 second.

the scan time has nothing to do with the nuclear magnetic relaxation time of water and everything to do with the voltages required at pin 9 of the 4046 chip
Am i wrong?

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 460
    • Global Kast : Water Fuel Cell Research
Re: WFC VIC
« Reply #263 on: March 15, 2011, 01:43:25 am »
all the voltages from the output of the gated pulsed via the transistor (vee/vcc) are 12v. The scanning range is set by pin 4 and the 4017, so for example the pulses that come out at pin 4 go to the 4017 which will be divided by 10 and are then sent back into the PLL via pin 3 and also these pulses are being fed back in with the gate pulse via pin 5. but the pulses coming straight out pin 4 could be 1khz -10khz and then once they go through the 1st 4017 its range is 100hz - 1khz and so on.