Author Topic: Impedance Matching  (Read 29024 times)

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2009, 05:32:59 am »
peak a boo

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2009, 05:57:28 am »
ok donald to your first tpoic on this page.....i think that is happening on the inside of the coil as well.....but in the end it comes down to series once you "zoom out" of the picture.....

and to your second post.....see there are the conflictions there....this is why i always keep going back and forth.......i just don't know yet.......the one resonant equation (4) says that xc=xl.....while the screengrab you posted says otherwise......it will either be a standing wave (eq 4) or a moving force into the capcitor via (eq 24)

so until the time comes again it once again comes down to a confliction......maybe stan made it work in 2 different ways in order to cover all possible ways around the patent.....but that sounds like a horrible idea.....maybe it works both ways....maybe not.....i really haven't a clue.....and this is what alan and i keep coming back too......this statement you have provided conflicts the 3 equations in the beginning of the tech brief (F, XC, XL)

so until we have a signal in a tube cell we won't know.

but these are great posts donald....thank you for screen grabbing that...i couldn't remember where i read that.

and a while ago i posted the math for the situation when inductor must be larger then capacitance in terms of reactance.....but one thing happens.....the frequency is different for the inductor and capacitor when it comes down to the reatance equations maybe that is a clue or trick.........then if that was the case all the equations would fit perfectly in those situations......hmmmm.....wait a minute this might actually have something to it.

i can write this out later....but i have to study!

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2009, 06:15:48 am »
yea it's lots of fun isn't it, i am going to have to spend a lot more time tearing the tech brief apart, as well as the patents and videos... and some non-stan electrical info... but learning new stuff each and every day is a great way to go

i've been thinking there could be a lot to learn from taking the example from the fuel gas patent, with the 4 inch cell, 100 turn inductors, and 200:600 toroid, and just hammer out every possible calculation for the circuit to understand the simplest form of the system

then i'm thinking it is a different process, a lot more action going on in the VIC Coil...

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2009, 16:51:00 pm »
Impedance is the resistance to AC in relation to frequency .

Ok kinesis . If  you think you can ``match the impedance`` of your coil to the impedance of your water cell than do it ... You are gonna need an RLC meter for this and see .

Remember to use very very pure water when you do your tests , perhaps they will be =  at certain frequency .

I say this because we know that the resistance of water will be low , this is a parallel resistance and some capacitance . The isnt the same kind of capacitor that acts like a open circuit with DC , thats why I think your ``impedance`` wont match .

Haitair , Stevie , plz help us out here .
 
We measure the ''impedance'' of positive choke coil 56 and our cell . Can the ''impedance'' of these 2 seperate components ever be matched ?
« Last Edit: April 27, 2009, 17:25:35 pm by Dankie »

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2009, 17:39:20 pm »

We measure the ''impedance'' of positive choke coil 56 and our cell . Can the ''impedance'' of these 2 seperate components ever be matched ?
Yes, because the impedances are dependant on the frequency of voltage the circuit is pulsed with.
As Meyer states, the impedance of a coil is XL, while the impedance of a capacitor is -XC, this is due to the complex numbers.
XL = jwL = j 2*pi*f*L
XC = 1/jwC = 1/j 2*pi*f*C ) = - j/wC

the whole resistance of a RLC series circuit is: Z = Rohm + XC + XL = Rohm  + j (wL - 1/wC)
|XC| and |XL| match at the resonant frequency of the circuit where the resistance is lowest, therefore power consumption is the highest, voltages at coil and cap are 180° out of phase and the voltage at both parts is the highest.
the grade of voltage amplification is determined by Q = Uc / U where Uc is the voltage at coil/capacitor and U the voltage which is put in.
Q is: (http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/0/7/e/07e52d56b2b580c4acb409744f69142e.png), as you see it's ~ 1/R. The thing with stainless steel wire is that because of it's massive resistance the quality of the circuit is extremely low and thus the voltage amplification.

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2009, 18:36:57 pm »
well i have to study for a full 12 hours today......2 exams one day 30 minutes apart......so after everything is done i will write up the math behind what is going on.......when it comes down to the XL reactance and XC reactance worked into XL>XC and our resonant frequency is found for the overall system it should be noted that the frequencies inside the capacitor and frequencies in the inductor are two completely different frequencies.

take equation 2 equation 3 equation 4 the concept from equation 24 and you will see what i am talking about....make the reactance larger for XL then XC......find the resonant frequency using eq 4 and then take the same information and input it into the reactance equations and you will see that there are 3 completely different frequencies.......these 3 different frequencies are ( the frequency in the inductor, the frequency in the capacitor, and the overal resonant frequency or combination of the other frequencies of the entire system).......there may in fact be harmonics going on here....but i have no time to work out the real numbers.......i will after wednesday.

this might be a huge part to our unsuccessful trials.

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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #22 on: April 27, 2009, 19:11:08 pm »
To test for your resonant frequency , just connect one of the chokes to your cell and pulse with an AC signal , perhaps use an ampli if your signal gen lacks power .






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Re: Impedance Matching
« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2009, 19:23:00 pm »
well i have to study for a full 12 hours today......2 exams one day 30 minutes apart......
yeah that sucks, this term we have to do practicals which are 4 hours long each week, next week is "measurement of non-sinusoidal voltages/currents". at least it's of use for the whole wfc thing ;)