Projects by members > Tony Woodside

My Thoughts on how Meyer split water

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TonyWoodside:
I am going to attempt to explain how Stan split the water molecule with low currents. Ok first thing, basic electrolysis uses current to slit water by using electron collision. In Stan's system he only wanted to use voltage and no current, which we all know by now. Well I've been digging deep into what Stan says in his lectures and memos. This is what I've come up with and it all make sense with what Stan says. Stan talks about the molecule and its "Ground State". Theground state of a system is its lowest-energy state. The energy of the ground state is known as the zero-point energy of the system. Basically the ground state refers to the electrons being in their correct orbit making them stable. Well Stan's talks about taking the molecule from ground state to excited state. Excitation is an elevation in energy level above an arbitrary baseline energy state. In physics there is a specific technical definition for energy level which is often associated with an atom being excited to an excited state. This means to make the electrons go from their correct orbit up to the next orbit. Like in the water molecule you have 2 orbital shells and the 1st orbit is the "K" shell and the 2nd orbit is the "L" shell. So to make the molecule go from ground state to exited state, the "L" shell electrons will  be ejected to what is know in electronics as the conduction band, which is just an imaginary location outside the orbit of the molecule. Once you have less than 8 electrons occupying the "L", you will then have the 2 electrons from the "K" orbit jumping into the "L" orbit. This will continue till all electrons are in the conduction band and the "K" and "L" orbits are empty. Once the orbits are empty there is obviously no covalent bonding between the Hydrogen and Oxygen atoms at this point.

Now I will explain how this can be achieved. The key to Stan's system is Harmonic Oscillation. The LC circuit has to be made to give a specific Harmonic Oscillation Wave Function. This wave function will mimic a particle equal to that of the electrons. When the electrons are hit will this wave function signal, they will go from ground state into excitation state. If you stop the signal, after a short time period the electrons will emit photons and then return to ground state. This is why Stan say pulse for X amount of time and then gate and gas will be produces for another X time period. The gate will allow the photon energy to be released and this photon energy will continue to produce more gas and allow the water to go back to ground state.

The Harmonic Oscillation Wave Function is very similar to an AM signal. The signal has to be the correct band of frequencies in order to split the water molecule. Puharich gives these specific frequency bands ( 3.98kHz, 7.96kHz, 15.95kHz, and 31.84kHz, which these frequencies are all sub-harmonics of 63.68kHz ) need to split the molecule. I've noticed in Stan's setup he uses chokes in around 1H each and if you calculate the capacitance of a single tube it will be around 1.6nF, by using L= 1H and C= 1.6nF, the resonant frequency will be 3.98kHz....is this just coincidence? I think NOT. Research Meyer and Puharich's system and you will see that these two system are very much alike. Here are some references on what I've just explained, research it and you will see that this is the way it was done.

http://dev.physicslab.org/asp/applets/javaphysmath/java/atomphoton/default.asp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_oscillator

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matter_wave

http://www.brightstorm.com/science/physics/the-atom-and-quantum-physics/matter-wave-de-broglie-wavelength

http://www.lsbu.ac.uk/water/vibrat.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morse_potential

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_harmonic_oscillator

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molecular_vibration

http://butane.chem.uiuc.edu/pshapley/GenChem2/A7/1.html

http://www.thefullwiki.org/Nuclear_magnetic_resonance

http://gregegan.customer.netspace.net.au/ORTHOGONAL/07/QM.html

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Quantum_LC_circuit

http://centros.edu.xunta.es/iesames/webantiga/webfq/EUSECTSUSO/chem_phys_bac/Chemistry_2/chemical_bonding.htm

http://universe-review.ca/F12-molecule.htm

Hope This info sheds some light on this process and how it works.

Thanks,
Tony Woodside

webmug:
Tony,

Based on the resonance cell specs we can calculate the capacitance:
permittivity (?)    =    708     picofarad/meter     (for water)
length (l)    =    2.75     inch
outer conductor diameter (b)    =    0.6250     inch     (based on air-gap 0.0625 inch)
inner conductor diameter (a)    =    0.5     inch

Note:
Now the specs used for the cell has a rod in the middle and is longer than the outer tube so it has more capacitance.
What you have (1.6nF) should be almost correct for the 5RC time.

Measured values:
C1(pos)=1262mH  (positive choke who has effect on resonance according to Dynodon)
C2(neg)=1138mH (tuned for balancing opposite and equal voltages [pos and neg exciters] and restrict current)

Fr=3.79kHz (calculated resonance frequency C1 and Cell) Is close to 3.98kHz which called the center frequency!

Question:
Isn't the frequency shifting above and below 3.98kHz? If the PLL has a lock it doesn't mean it has exactly 3.98kHz lock.

--- Quote from: TonyWoodside on December 29, 2010, 10:13:50 am ---Here some math based on Meyer and Puharich..they both say the RC time is 5kHz...this doesnt mean to pulse the circuit at 5kHz, this is just the RC time. Using the RC formula RC= 1/(2pi*f*C) we can find the pulsing frequency to fully charge the WFC. We know that the RC time is 5kHz and the cell used had a capacitance of 1.6nF, 3" single tube cell. So it breaks down like this:
RC = 1/(2pi*f*C)
5kHz = 1/(2pi*f*1.6nF)
f = (1/(2pi*1.6nF)) / 5kHz
f = 19904.46Hz
Now we have to take 19904.46Hz and divide it by 5, the reason we divide by 5 is because the 19904.46Hz is the RC total which equals to 5 Time Constants, 5TC.
19904.46Hz / 5 = 3980.89Hz
This 3980.89 Hz is the frequency that the circuit should be pulsed at. This number should look familiar because Puharich states this frequency in his water splitter patent!!!

-Tony Woodside-
http://www.globalkast.com

--- End quote ---

Don't know if it is important but what I also found is this:
Sec=1047mH. Notice (Sec+C1) =>1047+1262 =(2309/2)=1154mH comes close to C2 (1138mH)

What about the gate frequency to get the "resonant action" starting between the exciters?

Br,
Webmug

Lektor:
I will try to make a picture collage this weekend of all pictures I think could be useful to explain my ideas. Pictures explain best.

What do you mean when talking about resonance. Resonance of what? H2O, H2+O, H2, H H, H+? In my opinion we have two major tasks for H2 dissociation.
- H2O -> H2 + O via pulsed electric fields. Maybe even H2 -> H H
- H2 -> H H or -> H+ via photo dissociation.
Getting H2 could be enough though.

I just started to work myself into this topic and am still gathering informations. Until today I thought everything could be done by electric fields but when I read about photo dissociation I thought this could be useful too, especialy for the H2 -> HH part.

So I found this Document. http://www.freidok.uni-freiburg.de/volltexte/33/pdf/33_1.pdf  The diagrams and schematics of the experiment set-up had some interesting informations.
They used a laser with 400nm and a laser with 800nm whereas the 800nm laser created most ions. Red laser pointers have about 650nm so I think I will experiment with that. I don't know how fast it's possible to puls them but even as a continues photon source it could be useful. They also used piezo pumps and shot at the H2 in an rectangular angle, like Meyer did.

@TonyWoodside: Your Youtube videos showed that you were successful in replicating Meyer's electronics. What do you want to improve or on what are you working now? Have you tried to measure how many Watts you need for a liter?

Steve:

--- Quote from: Lektor on July 08, 2011, 23:05:06 pm ---I will try to make a picture collage this weekend of all pictures I think could be useful to explain my ideas. Pictures explain best.

What do you mean when talking about resonance. Resonance of what? H2O, H2+O, H2, H H, H+? In my opinion we have two major tasks for H2 dissociation.
- H2O -> H2 + O via pulsed electric fields. Maybe even H2 -> H H
- H2 -> H H or -> H+ via photo dissociation.
Getting H2 could be enough though.

I just started to work myself into this topic and am still gathering informations. Until today I thought everything could be done by electric fields but when I read about photo dissociation I thought this could be useful too, especialy for the H2 -> HH part.

So I found this Document. http://www.freidok.uni-freiburg.de/volltexte/33/pdf/33_1.pdf  The diagrams and schematics of the experiment set-up had some interesting informations.
They used a laser with 400nm and a laser with 800nm whereas the 800nm laser created most ions. Red laser pointers have about 650nm so I think I will experiment with that. I don't know how fast it's possible to puls them but even as a continues photon source it could be useful. They also used piezo pumps and shot at the H2 in an rectangular angle, like Meyer did.

@TonyWoodside: Your Youtube videos showed that you were successful in replicating Meyer's electronics. What do you want to improve or on what are you working now? Have you tried to measure how many Watts you need for a liter?

--- End quote ---

Thanks for that pdf, Lektor.
Good info on that laser frequency. Ions are the charge carriers in water.
I do have at this moment some basic lasers in my lab and playing with them to find out what the story is behind them.
Meyer explains a lot about them. Nobody reported yet that they had better results in production or efficiency with help of lasers.
The pdf is fascinating in a way that they might show us some direction in how to apply a laser.

Lektor, you talk about Meyer shooting at H2 in a rectangular manner. Can you specify more, please?

Steve

Lektor:
I think I have recognized a simularity between both experiment setups.
In this picture ( http://www.globalkast.com/images/stanmeyer/4826581b.jpg  the H2 is transported from bottom to top and LED's are emitting photons rectangular to the motion of the H2.

In the PDF file at "Konzept 1" on page 69 the H2 is shot via a piezo pump from left to right and a laser crosses this pass rectangular to it.

I think I have a better way to do it but I have to make some diagram to explain it.