Does anyone know what the reaction is , when theres no electrolyte?

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i agree with you in many aspects for example

i didnt said thunderstorm  wont break water.. i said they are not breaking it thru the switch off of the covalent bounding...

i didnt said your undertanding of plants are incorrect i just said is has little to do with the electrical polarization process...

"Molecules can be separated by taking the electrons away from them." ~ excite the electrons and take them away is the core science.

the above is nothing more than an obvious statement that tells that if you take the brick off from a wall the wall will fall...

words are meaningless without trust... if you dont trust what i say why should you trust in my tables... now why should i show you any?

can the water molecule be broken without any exchange of electrons?

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i agree with you in many aspects for example

i didnt said thunderstorm  wont break water.. i said they are not breaking it thru the switch off of the covalent bounding...

i didnt said your undertanding of plants are incorrect i just said is has little to do with the electrical polarization process...

"Molecules can be separated by taking the electrons away from them." ~ excite the electrons and take them away is the core science.

the above is nothing more than an obvious statement that tells that if you take the brick off from a wall the wall will fall...

words are meaningless without trust... if you dont trust what i say why should you trust in my tables... now why should i show you any?

can the water molecule be broken without any exchange of electrons?

Once again you try and belittle what I show as that statement has never been made before as it is an Original Idea. Why I am demanding that you show your work? The scientific method demands that I ask you for proof given in a like manor. I showed you a cost effective differential probe to get and you say it's a waste of money so I really don't expect you will even try to get a truly nice oscilloscope like that of Outlawstc or Max Miller has that have differential probes built right into the unit at a cost of around $5k USD. Show your work as you word is what is meaningless here as I have shown you mines did I not? What are you afraid of? That if you actually get a differential probe it will show the world that you are not getting 50kv to your exciter array which is 30kv over what Meyer says to be the working voltages to the exciter array?

Show us is all I am asking you to do but you come up with every excuse in the book as to why 'you' don't have to show the world your work while the rest of us do. If you need funds start a crowdfunding campaign as I am sure all of your supporters here will give you a hand at getting one as even I might donate to your crowdfunding campaign.

The bottom line is I have shown everyone my work and it has not been surpassed by anyone working in the field to this date. I have also provided my original idea so that everyone can make use of it as they go out looking to see if these things are actually taking place in the world around them. And I remind you that is an original idea so you are not going to find it printed in any of our books of antiquity hence the word Original. I didn't have to share that with anyone as I could have kept that to myself but I shared it with the hopes that others would also be able to understand how this technology actually works. Like I said the body of evidence presented to date is stacked in my favor and I am sure others will find more evidence as time goes on as all they needed was to know what to look for which is what the original idea I posted gives them.

However your words are unsettling as you say the only reason why you haven't gotten it up and working is that you are too lazy. That translates to the world doesn't have this technology right now for you are just too lazy to put in the work necessary so that the world can have this technology. These are your words not mines. Now I have a much clearer picture of the type of man that you actually are and I guess I should say thanks for providing that needed to know information about yourself to us all.

"my lazyness is the only thing between me and a working cell... " a quote from you.

Shalom,
TGS

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yes ´m lazy...

you welcome...

and thaNK FOR THAT IDEA that you cant make it work but its correct so if everyone know it someone will use it for `free`` and will be forever thankfull to you... ... you just make me laught too much... i cant wait to meet you one day;; you got to be a nice guy...

i´m the kind of man so lazy that dont really should waste my time or the good energy i get with this unfruitfull discussion.

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yes ´m lazy...

you welcome...

and thaNK FOR THAT IDEA that you cant make it work but its correct so if everyone know it someone will use it for `free`` and will be forever thankfull to you... ... you just make me laught too much... i cant wait to meet you one day;; you got to be a nice guy...

i´m the kind of man so lazy that dont really should waste my time or the good energy i get with this unfruitfull discussion.

What idea that I can't make work are you talking about? What holds me back is far different than what holds you back as I am being held back by all the waiting times between projects as I save up for, pay, and then have to wait until things are made. Steve can even tell you just what I am waiting for right now if he wanted too but really he doesn't have to as I have mentioned just what I am waiting for so that I can proceed with my efforts to get my exciter array up and working. I showed a voltage that is just 1.2kv short of Meyer's 10kv minimum and the changes made should allow me to finally reach Meyer's working voltages for the exciter array.

But one thing is totally clear now is you now understand that ionization does in fact break the bonds of the water molecules as well as everyone else that reads that post I made. So, the doubt of rather or not this technology has anything to do with ionization should be over as like a cloud this technology has capacitive zones also and share many other things like a high voltage potential for example.

This thread ask for a formula on this technology and we broke things down to being that of hydronium and hydroxide ions. From our research it's clear that the hydronium ions are held together to strongly and we also learned that the single bond of the hydroxide ions are sad to be easily broken. Thus it is a logical conclusion that the gas production will be coming from the hydroxide ions as they are being broken down by way of ionization.

We even started planning for future experiments designed further our knowledge on rather or not the hydronium concentration will go up as a results of the process and if it does at what rate does it have towards dropping back down to a level 7 ph balance. These are being planned for in lew of Meyer's words and illustrations where Meyer talks about the reaction producing gases after it has been turned off.

(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y320/h2opower/2015-08-23_223806_zpsn84kltrl.png)

This is what we are talking about shown in this picture taken from the SMTB as the curve suggest something getting pushed out of equilibrium and then the time it takes for it be go back into equilibrium. These are the experiments we are talking about preparing for and the reasons why we feel we need to perform the experiments. If we can show a increase in the hydronimum concentration for then we know that it is the hydroxide ions that are being broken down to produce the usable fuel gases on demand with Meyer's technology.

As you can see we are moving forwards while you are still debating the tech to be ionization based or not.

Shalom,
TGS

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Yes ionization could break molecule... all ok, just dont put words in my mouth... i dont think meyer break the molecules thru this process, alone... if this is really ever achieved or needed...

i wont tell my theory here.. but it consist into thinking how else could i break the molecule... why would it break... and how i do it without amps...

i can tell you that when you understand my theory (stan theory) you will see

why voltage perform work ( maybe your differential probe told you that already)i had to see with my multimeter...

i proposed this experiment here a while ago but i guess no one seems to have tried it so unfortunately i have no other confirmation than my tests and tables with results...just connecting thecells in series and put a voltmeter across them and pulse the inner electrode with high freq high voltage,,, this is the same as having a differential probe with very high insulation fromground depending where are you multimeters cables and where its standing...

how the diode turns off and why it prevent electrons from shorting to the secondary

you will also see that there is no point trying to win an argument by the force... there is no difference if the gas will come out ionized or not untill it comes out and we can see how its face looks like..

only there we can put a resistor together connected from ground to a grid passing the gas thru it and see the way the current will flow...

or make it flow in a coiled tube and measure the magnetic force for example...

thats the way science really works...

the autoionization is a limited process timelimited... i have in the university of biology a friend that gives me water from a purifier i just forgot the name but costs like 30000 dollars and makes the water used for dna manipulations... they give me as much as i want... but just to you see the water start to get conductive as it gets out of the filter... the air in contact with it start to lend nitrogen to its matrix, oxygen, gases, and Co2 and others gases dissolves forming conductive electroilyte.. thats how they discovered it.. they realized that there was no way to keep taking ions out of water they would ever keep apearing and making the conductance never get to zero.

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about the resonant action.. where the gas keep comming out... thats because stan said it is arranged to become as self sustained oscillation system... it mean that when he gates it the oscillation on the coils will keep going...

i will tell you one thing guys


in my opinion of a simple man the wfc is a sort of capacitor that has a capacitance leap when the gas is generated... when this happens across the cell a very high voltage apear across the cell... its analogous to change the dielectric value or forcing charged electrodes to go far from each other...

this is

sit where you are

amplification  of energy

right?

so if we get the point where gas is generated and the Q factor of the system is above a certain value the system will indeed oscillate undefinately untill parameter change and its pulled out of resonance or actually up to the point where theres no more water

now you see why resonance action? do you see i´m not bla bla bla my friend?

do you see that if you ionize water it gets conductive and you kill the high voltage you are trying to put into it... at least in one point of view electric fields are also defined by the current going thru a resistive media so if you get both equations aside you see that if you get purer water is even better than filling with chemicals for example even if the chemical would distort the molecules making them weakened ... 

you kill the high voltage from the inside, yes you generate a small gas since you are breaking the molecule by ionization... however as you do this you are just doing a very high brute force electrolysis... just the same... you are ionizind because there is nothing less to allow the current flow.. big deal the real big problem with electrolysis sis that you need to set an overvoltage potential and this leads the efficiency to such small factor, including polarization is what really causes the electrolysis to be unefficient...  you set a potential and the cell set a backelectromotive potential that force you to add at least this amount of potential to the electron so it can win the barrier and pass thru``..

you see your ionization idea duplicate this error in a gigantic manner... HV+HIGH AMPS = HIGH POWER 

YOU ARE GOOD INTENTION i value that.. i hope you just ask yourself...is there anyone in this world who maybe know something else i dont?

i guess my secret is to ask this every day to my self and try to understand what i dont!

if you leave something on for 1 second and it keeps on for 90 seconds the Q and amplification factor is very huge

i told you all this and yet didnt touched my theory.. thats because its to be released if i prove that its correct or just to tell you what i did and you can do also if you want... 

my idea is not to be the hho man... i just want to make it work and put all of you in front of it and ask if you want to change the world in the way its better to be... than if you want to help great otherwise you get your water car and keep going...

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about the resonant action.. where the gas keep comming out... thats because stan said it is arranged to become as self sustained oscillation system... it mean that when he gates it the oscillation on the coils will keep going...

i will tell you one thing guys


in my opinion of a simple man the wfc is a sort of capacitor that has a capacitance leap when the gas is generated... when this happens across the cell a very high voltage apear across the cell... its analogous to change the dielectric value or forcing charged electrodes to go far from each other...

this is

sit where you are

amplification  of energy

right?

so if we get the point where gas is generated and the Q factor of the system is above a certain value the system will indeed oscillate undefinately untill parameter change and its pulled out of resonance or actually up to the point where theres no more water

now you see why resonance action? do you see i´m not bla bla bla my friend?

do you see that if you ionize water it gets conductive and you kill the high voltage you are trying to put into it... at least in one point of view electric fields are also defined by the current going thru a resistive media so if you get both equations aside you see that if you get purer water is even better than filling with chemicals for example even if the chemical would distort the molecules making them weakened ... 

you kill the high voltage from the inside, yes you generate a small gas since you are breaking the molecule by ionization... however as you do this you are just doing a very high brute force electrolysis... just the same... you are ionizind because there is nothing less to allow the current flow.. big deal the real big problem with electrolysis sis that you need to set an overvoltage potential and this leads the efficiency to such small factor, including polarization is what really causes the electrolysis to be unefficient...  you set a potential and the cell set a backelectromotive potential that force you to add at least this amount of potential to the electron so it can win the barrier and pass thru``..

you see your ionization idea duplicate this error in a gigantic manner... HV+HIGH AMPS = HIGH POWER 

YOU ARE GOOD INTENTION i value that.. i hope you just ask yourself...is there anyone in this world who maybe know something else i dont?

i guess my secret is to ask this every day to my self and try to understand what i dont!

if you leave something on for 1 second and it keeps on for 90 seconds the Q and amplification factor is very huge

i told you all this and yet didnt touched my theory.. thats because its to be released if i prove that its correct or just to tell you what i did and you can do also if you want... 

my idea is not to be the hho man... i just want to make it work and put all of you in front of it and ask if you want to change the world in the way its better to be... than if you want to help great otherwise you get your water car and keep going...

I'll take this to my thread as I'd like massive and I to keep working together on this.

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Im readng george Wisemans book at the moment , in his hunt to unravel Yull Browns technology he discovered series plates , all of which are neutral .
he removed the transformer so theres no transformer loses because he was after low volts , approx 2 volt per cell .
240 vac / 2 v = 120 cells . he uses a bridge rectifier and ac caps for power supply current limiting.
so as far as electrolysis he has already raised effeciency over traditional technology and his gas out put is monatomic which has more volume .
V x I = W    , by lowering V to essential level only , it is more effecient.

I was thinking last night about OH+ , being easiest bond to break . O = 8p , 8n ,8e  , leaving H+ = 1p !!!!!

so is H+ an authentic chemical  OR purely electrical entity OR purely theoretical ??

sounds simply stuppid but anyhoo ..... if H+ is a single proton and called a hydrogen ion then what are the 8 protons in the nucleus of the Oxygen atom ??

are H+ "ions" the building blocks of the nucleus ??

(so electrons and holes is another way of picturing what is going on)

all the while focus is on SM and his invention, the other inventors must be considered at the same time , after all they achieved H gas out puts also and with out traditional electrolysis

Herman Anderson (king of the ion) , A Puharich , S Horvath .

was the output monatomic or diatomic or both or ionized gas being either ,+ ion or - ion

on that basis HOW did it get to be ionized ? that leads back to the "process" , either electrons were given or taken OR the gas was monatomic , diatomic OR both , that leads back to the "process" also

so is Oxygen , 8H+ , 8n , 8e ?       proton being H+ , sounds stuppid but isnt a proton a proton ?

just a thought...