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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: tektrical on July 04, 2020, 01:15:28 am

Title: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 04, 2020, 01:15:28 am
I've got a simple millivolt hv supply.  I took two identical transformers from some wall plug adaptors and reverse wired them, with series outputs.  The 12 Volt transformers are now putting out 2400V, at approximately one milliamp.  I'm using a string of four 1n4006 diodes which are each rated at 800V and one Amp.  With a 7MFd current limiting cap on the input, the diodes just barely get warm.  Without the cap, everything over heats, because the small transformers' secondaries aren't designed to be hooked to the mains, as primary windings.

This supply produces a small but respectable amount of little bubbles, which do pop under a flame.  (Using well water).  Something I've noticed is that with my plate cells, separated by thin strips of plastic, the bubbles are primarily produced where the plastic touches the metal.

 Now I'll reverse wire a couple of MOTs and run them with a genset, rather than a small inverter.  I'll current limit them with one or two motor running capacitors.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 01:47:51 am
With this assembly, a single transformer is adequate for running a cell.  So I can run two cells, with the optional diode and using the secondary cross over wire as a center tap.

When I designed this configuration I was hoping for a bipolar output, and I've verified that is what it provides.  It's ike a single transformer with a center tap, when such is not available otherwise.  (As with a MOT).  With some added components, I can test this for powering a shape resonance circuit.

Using this with one cell, without the optional diode, gives opposing positive and negative pulses to the electrodes, with an additional unbalanced positive pulse going to one electrode.  Or perhaps I should reverse this polarity since almost all of the bubbles are coming off the negative electrode, whether it's on the inside or the outside.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 10:40:09 am
So the two output leads provide a pulse at the same time?
Should they cancel eachother out?
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 11:26:19 am
So the two output leads provide a pulse at the same time?
Should they cancel eachother out?

The pulses have opposite polarity.  So this is actually doubling the intensity of the potential.  I tried wiring the secondaries straight across, and that's when the pulses cancelled out.  But it still works with a single transformer pumping hv electrons into the water.  Apparently, the second electrode builds a positive charge which pulls against the negative pulses, even when the pulses are out of phase.

This must be what Stan meant about switching off the covalent bonds.  With electrons all around, the Oxygen doesn't have to hang on to the Hydrogen to get it's extra electrons.

This definitely isn't normal water splitting since the bubbles only come off one electrode.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 12:56:19 pm
 Can you post a video here of yr gas production with a view on the electrodes?
Compliments!
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 13:16:39 pm
Sounds like an afternoon project.  Give me 8 or 10 hours.  The only video I have right now is the plate cell, and it doesn't show the negative electrode bubbles.  Plus, waiting for the sun to recharge everything.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 05, 2020, 22:07:55 pm
I finally got a video, but I can't attach it to this site.  I'll have to put it on YouTube, and that's going to take a while, setting up a new account for this subject matter.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 00:50:05 am
You know guys one thing i have being think about...
 
how could we use multiphase to create a sort of low voltage coil winding to have something like dc on it without the need of diodes... 

the electrodes shape should somehow perhaps help the ac to get filtered while keep a dc flow..

but what kind of device could create this low voltage high current dc current?

i have being thinking about it and perhaps is what we miss... activating the molecules with the high voltage seems to be only half the story to me...

Dc is required to complete the reactions on the electrodes so far as i concluded..  i think the key wold be to have a source of 500mv with high amperage would be enough if mix up with the ac to do the job...

how to generate dc with no diodes ?

i know how it can be done with mosfets but is a bit expensive to do...

i think we are missing something...

basically what i see is that when the molecules is broken from the ac field every increasing under resonance.. when the molecules are not able to discharge with their counter pair they simply move back and reform water molecule...
if we could isolate capacitively the cell we could verify that... high dielectric ceramics container would be a much to test with... but my guess is that meyer tried to make this isolation with resistors and inductors to block the flow of current to negligible amounts instead of using ceramics....

a resistor will create an isolation depending of course on the concept of isolation used.. the current flowing will create a potential gradient..

so maybe using a couple of them and different circuitry we could do some injury to water stability.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 01:27:21 am
I finally got a video, but I can't attach it to this site.  I'll have to put it on YouTube, and that's going to take a while, setting up a new account for this subject matter.

I got it uploaded, but something was lost in the translation: I can barely see the bubbles on YouTube.  I'll make another cell that isn't so cloudy.

https://youtu.be/pgf7sKajqWc (https://youtu.be/pgf7sKajqWc)
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 04:28:12 am
You know guys one thing i have being think about...
 
how could we use multiphase to create a sort of low voltage coil winding to have something like dc on it without the need of diodes... 

the electrodes shape should somehow perhaps help the ac to get filtered while keep a dc flow..

but what kind of device could create this low voltage high current dc current?

i have being thinking about it and perhaps is what we miss... activating the molecules with the high voltage seems to be only half the story to me...

Dc is required to complete the reactions on the electrodes so far as i concluded..  i think the key wold be to have a source of 500mv with high amperage would be enough if mix up with the ac to do the job...

how to generate dc with no diodes ?

i know how it can be done with mosfets but is a bit expensive to do...

i think we are missing something...

basically what i see is that when the molecules is broken from the ac field every increasing under resonance.. when the molecules are not able to discharge with their counter pair they simply move back and reform water molecule...
if we could isolate capacitively the cell we could verify that... high dielectric ceramics container would be a much to test with... but my guess is that meyer tried to make this isolation with resistors and inductors to block the flow of current to negligible amounts instead of using ceramics....

a resistor will create an isolation depending of course on the concept of isolation used.. the current flowing will create a potential gradient..

so maybe using a couple of them and different circuitry we could do some injury to water stability.

Hi Fabio,

There are a number of ways to accomplish the rectification you're suggesting.  A mechanical system known as a synchronous rectifier spins a shaft at just the right speed so that input brushes always contact appropriate output sector electrodes during the time the brushes have the desired polarity.

Nicola Tesla and Ed Gray both used batteries to impart a DC offset to an applied signal.  As long as there are enough batteries in series to bring the low point of the signal up to zero volts or higher, the signal will then be rectified.

As you suspect, a voltage gradient can have utility for producing a DC offset.  I've shown that concentric rings, with differing potentials, will produce an offset when positioned adjacent to a thin sheet of resistive charcoal.  And the mineral Tourmaline has a natural gradient, due to the types of atoms ordered along the length of its crystalline molecules.

A metal triangle intended for use as a rectifier may have to incorporate a slight bow.  With my shape resonance circuit, a small tapered alligator clip blocks reverse multiphasic current, but a flat metal triangle doesn't.  E. Whittaker is famous for showing that a static charge can be decomposed into a set of bidirectional waves, with at least one wave including a harmonic.  When a positive charge is momentarily applied to a properly shaped electrode (which doesn't have to metal), multiphasic energy can then flow in only one direction along the electrode - away from the point, but never towards the point.  This allows charge to self organize on the electrode (hopefully, at least as fast as it drains off through the water), if the electrode is thereafter connected only at its point.  And I've found that batteries having concentric electrodes can also exhibit the charge organising effect, making these batteries suitable for producing a milliamp offset without being discharged.

If you want to produce a heavy Low Voltage current, combine some regular LV current with some entraining unidirectional HV potential, then run it through a step down transformer.  No rectifier needed.  (Since you asked, I'll look up the patent number).

And I do agree with your thoughts about ceramics.  There's a good chance Stan's injector had a ceramic insulated, positive inner electrode, with the gas and mist directly contacting the negative outer electrode.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 06:15:09 am
Stan cited in his patents the tayhehan patent that talks about dissociation by collision...

in my view stan used this same effect somehow...


i think that meyer effect was a manner to stimulate the molecules at the same time but being able to hold the charge the higher the charge more molecules will be involved...

so after a certain amount of charge there is just need of that pick

somehow i believe he used a kind of dc potential as a manner of having a great number of molecules on the electrodes than when you apply opposite voltage it can shake the molecules... the idea is to attract and repel...

for example when we have a 20mf capacitor with a 2v charge.. how much force it does in the circuit?

actually is not 2v  because as current is discharged it will have a voltage drop inside the capacitor so it will be able to keep only for a small time...

when we get a resonance with a very low resistance coil and good capacitors it can accumulate lot of power but this reactive power is not lost... but what is the difference between having 100v on a transformer secondary than 100v on a resonant tank? well i think the main difference is that a transformer is not actually giving power to make that voltage... its using flux variation... when you have a resonant tank you are applying power to it in a phase where it can aways receive the power and increase... the voltage can be the same... but if you would try to shortcut the current the lc circuit would give a nice power bang while the transformer would limit the current because of the high impedance

water as we know dont make a good capacitor... but meyer talks about capacitive cells
 
honestly i can be bullshitt what im saying but

what if we could use this high current flowing in the lc tanks to induce a current to flow in the cells perpendicular to the original current flow so somehow would not consume power.

I think multiphase is requirement for this... i think at least 2 or even maybe 3 resonant tanks could be required to maintain this condition... but the main impression i have is that we are going to find a way to use this to drive the current in the cells..
 

Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 06:17:43 am
what would happen if we have perhaps a coaxial cable at resonance... ?

what if we are missing something?
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 11:07:54 am
i was going to sleep few hours ago and remember one thing... in a coil if we pulse it with dc the current want to keep the same direction.... the secondary will show the voltage impressed on the primary therefore the current in the secondary can go in both ways...

i imagined some cells connected in series forming a turn a primary

if we pulse it we should have that the current want to keep flowing during pulse off

i think with one cell would be hard to get to see this effect but with some isolated series cells the effect could be measured thru a diode...
considering the 10 cells like a turn of a transformer.. having a diode across the transformer like usual... in my opinion this would be able to kind of hold the charge on water... a shorted coil will have less resistance and keep current flow as max as it can...

if we want the cell to keep the charge we must at least give it a way to keep the current flow when pulse terminate... doubling the frequency if you want to see this way... the polarity of the electrodes will flip but current will keep going same direction!!!!

Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 20:22:13 pm
I made a new cell which is much clearer and you can clearly see the bubbles in the video.  These bubbles are pouring up off of the center electrode, with none coming from the outer electrode.

https://youtu.be/fZBtVjr2d9s (https://youtu.be/fZBtVjr2d9s)
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 23:00:23 pm
This doesn't do anything with distilled water.  Although I'm not adding anything to the well water, there's obviously impurities which act as an electrolyte.  And when it's connected to a car battery, with lots of Amps, there's lots of bubbles, even from the grid, but the bubbles are smaller.

Running this with the transformers, my electroscope doesn't indicate a static charge on either electrode.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 06, 2020, 23:21:49 pm
I tested my plate cell with a car battery and it literally boils.  So for my purposes of producing a usable quantity of fuel gas I may just go with electrolysis.  I'm still going to use my new transformer assembly for some more shape resonance experiments.

but what kind of device could create this low voltage high current dc current?


That's the exact opposite of what I'm discussing on this thread, but IF you're interested, I'll look up the patent and post the number.  (Presuming you don't just use a step down transformer with a diode).  Otherwise, you have the floor.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 07, 2020, 00:01:54 am
Im...

i guess an electroscope work with ac too.. but perhaps would show slight smaller voltage  (average)

when we get an static charge on the electrode in reference to ground we have a collection of counter ions and molecules on that electrode... the number of molecules and ions will be proportional to voltage... so the diference between 1v and 2 volt is twice the charge... likely 10kv is 10thousand times more charge than 1v... im talking about static charge....  the charge however in water bath will  certainly not stay on the electrode... for example if its positive it will endup ionizing the bath and giving the static charge to the inner wall of the container.. .

would be interesting to discharge the inner wall of the container to allow the electrode to keep having this situation otherwise although theres going to be a eletcric potential gradient it will be pretty much on the container itself..

if we add a 40Mohm resistor to the outer electrode and ground having 1ma flow with 40kv the voltage across the cell would be small but is there

the question is where is the fields.. 

i think you need a thick acrylic to have some decent isolation to get static charge upthere...

we need to guarantee the charges will not be able to stabilize..
Title: Forgive me if im wrong
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 07, 2020, 00:50:30 am
Im going to show an idea and remember some

van de graf teached us how to charge from inside to get a bucket with high voltage from a low voltage

Lord kelving showed that a slight charge unbalance can lead to high voltage with his water dropper

And some how the back to the future film came up with a delorean car with flux capacitor that supposed to do something

i was in a discussion about the plane earth hahah with a friend and they were arguing that if we cannot see the boat at horizont is because of difraction of light or something... but i explained to them that if we are in the same medium it will not have this difraction it only happens when you look from diferent medium like when you see a fork inside water is going to look strange if you look outside from water but will not look strange if you look from inside...

likewise i will start from the end... i was doing two drawings to explain my idea to you and came up with another memory :

CHARGING BY INDUCTION (FLUX CAPACITOR) HAHA

basically when you charge an electroscope permanently by induction you are using the electric fields to set up a displacement of charges that favors the neutralization

well the same is for a capacitor

if you apply high voltage to one side initially the other leg will have pretty much the same voltage applied to it and will start to ionize air and likely to charge the capacitor slowly a bit

well

let me show you the drawings and lets talk about that

lets stick to the first drawing

you see that you have a resonant tank and it can be driven in series or in parallel.. it will bring to high voltage easily at the resonant frequency...

at resonant frequency in series the Z goes to zero so it will have only the resistance of the coil and "water" as a damping factor so you can calculate the voltage Vt needed for a certain current I you desire. I=V/R

knowing the voltage Vt the frequency F and the current I and XL you know the resonant voltage I*XL ... the circulating current is the same as is in series

well now comes the interesting part how could we use one electrode to induce a current on the other electrode?

I was imagining the capacitance between each and ground and came up with the following idea

if we connect a capacitor between the electrodes in this configuration we could have some different stuff happening since this capacitance will stay charged will not participate much to the resonance after charged and likewise will give some connection between the electrodes... perhaps a very high capacitance would be nice to keep the charge on each electrode...

when a certain current is achieved the water must split at very high rate... and will be high voltage generated...

the diodes can be really a bunch of up to 50x 4007 diodes in parallel... i like to use the UF4007 version  the more diodes less loss will be on them...

also the coils should be thick to get a decent resonance.. or you can just apply more voltage... likewise more power will be dissipated on them

the water will heat up and container too... this are the losses...

http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4139.0;attach=16160;image

the nice thing of the test 2 circuit is that the resonance happens with the fields jumping from one coil to the other... and more it jumps when is at maximum value. perhaps it can be an advantage to think this way
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 07, 2020, 02:15:41 am
i think this jump i referred to ... maybe is what meyer call the electron bounce phenomenon

by setting the two coils in resonance what happens is that the two coils will only have current in one direction it will flip the magnetic field because of ac current.. however imagine 30amps going in one direction sudenly the diode wont allow more conduction because of reversal of polarity so you get 30 amps jumping from one coil to the other

we could apply dc to both sides and it would have a magnetic field connecting those coils too

something tells me that a higher diameter coil would be good to use... perhaps around the cell...

it would induce a current on the rods and could get hot.. maybe a tube is better.. or maybe 430ss material

what if meyer was using only the inside electrodes to generate gas and the outer as a manner to ionize only?

who knows

perhaps we can take advantage of this magnetic field somehow...
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 07, 2020, 21:07:30 pm
Hi Tek,

Thanks for making that video.
It looks fun.
You burned the gas, you wrote?
What type of explosions did you get? A soft one with a yellow flame?
Or the loud bang of HHO?


cheers!
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 07, 2020, 22:42:08 pm
That was with the plate cell, because it doesn't have a lid and some of the bubbles were big enough to pop, making the characteristic hho bang.  This still proves that my Simple VIC is working.

Fabio has the floor; discussion should be on topic and relevant to the ideas and theories he thinks this particular thread should be about.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 08, 2020, 12:12:50 pm
sorry if i went off topic... i was trying to propose an experiment for you and some thoughts for you consider while doing yours.. sometimes i hope that someone will maybe understand what im saying and complete some holes missing... im going to create a new topic for it and try to put in an organized manner..



Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 08, 2020, 17:56:29 pm
Steve once said this forum isn't about solving Meyer's technology or proving we can make bubbles.  It's about discussion.  So I'll leave you with it.  I've lost enthusiasm for discussing the experiments which led to my latest discoveries since no enthusiasm was returned.

Thanks to the four members who watched my video.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 08, 2020, 22:19:22 pm
actually im very enthusiastic to see your work.... Keep going, never give up.. i felt this way sometimes but we must not give up because there is no attention or response... i feel like i wrote so many times and got zero response too, but is just the way people come and go...

About your video.. i would like to ask what is the material of the outer electrode? you mention it does not generate oxygen but it appear to me it can be oxidizing..

hope to see more of what are you doing... and soon i plan to post some to my project section too...

Best Regards

=D

Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 09, 2020, 00:39:41 am
Being ignored is one thing, but disruption is entirely different.  I've been on the forums long enough to know there'll always be someone ready to step up to the plate and pull attention away from my presentation if it's about something new or sensitive.  So I've decided to move on.  I did get a couple of things from this forum: the new single wire circuit and the fact that a resistance increases the voltage.  So I'll still check in sometimes.  Good luck with your discussion.

PS:  Your question seems like a begged response.  But yes, the steel grid will rust if I leave it in the water very long.  The galvanised coating is already oxidized and that gives the electrode a P type semiconductor junction on its surface.  Plenty of bubbles there if this junction is cleaned off.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 09, 2020, 03:31:30 am
Being ignored is one thing, but disruption is entirely different.  I've been on the forums long enough to know there'll always be someone ready to step up to the plate and pull attention away from my presentation if it's about something new or sensitive.  So I've decided to move on.  I did get a couple of things from this forum: the new single wire circuit and the fact that a resistance increases the voltage.  So I'll still check in sometimes.  Good luck with your discussion.

PS:  Your question seems like a begged response.  But yes, the steel grid will rust if I leave it in the water very long.  The galvanised coating is already oxidized and that gives the electrode a P type semiconductor junction on its surface.  Plenty of bubbles there if this junction is cleaned off.

not sure what is going on but i just wanted to share somethoughs im very busy lately and don't share much with you recently so i just wrote some food for thought did not mean to disrupt you line of thinking. sorry if it sounded this way somehow. please dont get me wrong im indeed happy to see you all works!
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 10, 2020, 03:14:37 am
Correction: according to Wikipedia, zinc oxide is an n-type semiconductor.

Anyone who's interested can figure out the rest themselves.
Title: Re: Reverse Wired Transformers
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 10, 2020, 09:41:46 am
Electrical properties
ZnO has a relatively large direct band gap of ~3.3 eV at room temperature. Advantages associated with a large band gap include higher breakdown voltages, ability to sustain large electric fields, lower electronic noise, and high-temperature and high-power operation. The band gap of ZnO can further be tuned to ~3–4 eV by its alloying with magnesium oxide or cadmium oxide.[12]

Most ZnO has n-type character, even in the absence of intentional doping. Nonstoichiometry is typically the origin of n-type character, but the subject remains controversial.[30] An alternative explanation has been proposed, based on theoretical calculations, that unintentional substitutional hydrogen impurities are responsible.[31] Controllable n-type doping is easily achieved by substituting Zn with group-III elements such as Al, Ga, In or by substituting oxygen with group-VII elements chlorine or iodine.[32]

Reliable p-type doping of ZnO remains difficult. This problem originates from low solubility of p-type dopants and their compensation by abundant n-type impurities. This problem is observed with GaN and ZnSe. Measurement of p-type in "intrinsically" n-type material is complicated by the inhomogeneity of samples.[33]

Current limitations to p-doping limit electronic and optoelectronic applications of ZnO, which usually require junctions of n-type and p-type material. Known p-type dopants include group-I elements Li, Na, K; group-V elements N, P and As; as well as copper and silver. However, many of these form deep acceptors and do not produce significant p-type conduction at room temperature.[12]

Electron mobility of ZnO strongly varies with temperature and has a maximum of ~2000 cm2/(V·s) at 80 K.[34] Data on hole mobility are scarce with values in the range 5–30 cm2/(V·s).[35]

ZnO discs, acting as a varistor, are the active material in most surge arresters.[36][37]

the elevated band gap means it needs a higher electric field to become conductor... its used as a varistor element because when it reach a certain voltage field it become conductive and its resistance is restored when the field applied is not there anymore.

it may have a function in the cell working as a sort of dielectric? thats what you mean?

did you verify what is the lowest voltage at witch you will have current flow?

i was testing with potassium nitrate and ss and it need twice the voltage required than potassium hydroxide for example..

i think is possible to plate zinc over an electrode of copper or iron.. pehaps with some zinc sulfate and a piece of metalic zinc...

https://media.pearsoncmg.com/bc/bc_0media_chem/chem_sim/html5/Electro/Electro.php