Author Topic: New VIC pictures discussion!!!  (Read 39047 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 68
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #72 on: February 15, 2009, 04:18:17 am »
Thats the spirit  !!!!!!!

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 121
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #73 on: February 15, 2009, 14:52:58 pm »
Water Fuel Cell Technical Brief                     7-4

Inductor (614) and Inductor (615) of Figure (7-1) is wound or coil-wrapped in such a manner as to increase the magnetic flux intensity  between the turns of coil-wrap. The circular-spiral turns of wire is separated by an Insulated Dielectric Coating Material which forms a series of capacitors when magnetic flux-lines produces Electromagnetic Coupling Field during pulse on-time. The series resistance value is determined by ~e composition of the wire material in terms of its ohmic value per given length and diameter cross-section: Resonant Charging Chokes (614/615) 430F/FR 36 A WG (.006) stainless steel (s/s) wire equals 60 micro ohms per centimeter; Primary Coil (622) 22 A WG (.028)  copper wire equals 5.1933 ohms per pound weight; Secondary Pickup Coil (623) 35 A WG (.007)  copper wire equals 13K ohms per pound weight. "Pyre-ML" trade name "Himol" polymer coating-material is used to impart thermal and mechanical resistance to the stainless steel (s/s) wire coating; both magnet wire sizes uses solderable Nysol (Polyurethane Nylon Jacket) insulation enamel coating as a electrical shield-material ... all dielectric coatings having an effective 3KV per mil dielectric value and formulated specifically to endure automotive temperature range from _ 40 0 to 1550 C.


If we use the above wire sizes, limit the chokes to 11.6K ohms, and wind all the cavities full we would get a 17.5:1 ratio stepup between the primary and secondary.

If we used the .030 wire for the primary, limit the chokes, and filled all the cavities it would be a 20.9:1 ratio   

The larger primary wire the less heat the coil will generate.  I don't know if heat will be a factor.



Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 387
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #74 on: February 16, 2009, 02:06:49 am »
Meyer said about the ss choke
60 micro Ohm per cm
11.6K Ohm Total
 that would mean 11600 / 0.00006 = 193333333,33 cm = 6444444,44 feet ss wire needed

Dankies 19.774 ohm is high indeed compared to what Meyer proposed :)

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 363
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #75 on: February 17, 2009, 18:17:50 pm »
your math is off,there are 6 numers to the right of the decimal point.Yours only has 5.Stan states 11.6k ohms/ft.So dankies wire measures 19.775  devided into 11.6k equals 586.5992415 feet.Thats how many feet you will need with this wire period!!! Stans papers also say circular mil,not sure what he means.
Don

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 657
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #76 on: February 17, 2009, 18:54:02 pm »
plus wire gauge is also a factor.....which could be the c-mil.....come this summer i will be electrically inclined.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Sr. member
  • ***
  • Posts: 387
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #77 on: February 17, 2009, 19:34:45 pm »
can't find anything about c-mils in the tech brief, in which paper have you seen it?
the decimals seem ok to me, unless you want to nitpick on significant figures.

Your calculated length is correct, period yes, but I don't understand why Stan mentions 60 micro Ohm per CM length of wire, this takes too much wire for 11k6 Ohm  total.
what is the number between the parentheses based on? -> AWG (0.006)


thnx

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 121
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #78 on: February 17, 2009, 20:59:59 pm »
This is part of a chart I have in Excel If anyone wants the file I'll email it to you.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 657
Re: New VIC pictures discussion!!!
« Reply #79 on: February 18, 2009, 00:19:41 am »
alan you are correct about cmil not being in the tech brief.....BUT.....as it states in the tech brief 60 micro ohms per cm fo STAINLESS STEEL....alright so that is 60 x 10^-6...or 60 e-6

now lets look at resistive wire measurements on wikipedia......
notice how stainless steel says 90 e-6 ohms per cm....or 90 micro ohms per cm

this translates into 541 ohm-cmil per ft......ohm-cmil refers to circular mils...no 36 gauage wire as dankie has has a cmil of 25.....according to american wire gauge standards.....

so plug this into the equation
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/kinesisfilms/10223.png)

we want our resistance to be 11600 plus we have calculated that we will need 586.59 wraps of this wire with our current diameter size.....thus we will need a wire with a 494.4 ohm-cmil per ft.....and as in the wikipedia table stainless steel wire has 541 ohm-cmil/ft......

SO OUR MATH IS CORRECT and IN THE RIGHT RANGE!

you are applying 60 micro ohms as a length when in fact it is to be applied in accordance with the "p" factor for a circular cross section.....remember a wire is a 3 dimensional shape with volume......a simple mistake.....


here is a great website if you are still lost.

but rest assured everything is correct so far.

the one equation that is still bothering me is (eq 19) from memo WFC 426 of the tech brief....where wa = L I squared over Z......