Author Topic: Spiral Wire Electrodes  (Read 8161 times)

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Spiral Wire Electrodes
« on: September 29, 2016, 00:17:44 am »
I've seen a variety of electrolysis electrodes on YouTube.  One guy made a tiny hho welding torch using a syringe and some double edge razor blades for the cell.  Someone else is using ss cover plates from weather proof electrical boxes.  About the cheapest is spirals made from ss hardware wire.  So I tried that one:

(https://s20.postimg.org/6arapkk6l/Spiral_Electrodes.jpg)

One spiral was wrapped around the lag bolt, the other around the spring.  A smaller wrap holds its size better.  They're assembled with hot glue and a short piece of half inch plastic tube.

My pictures show distilled water with a quarter teaspoon of salt.  The negative spiral puts off the most bubbles, but that works with either the inner one or the outer one.  After a while, the water gets filled with tiny bubbles, but they never go below the bottom of the spirals.

This unit was hooked up directly to a 60 Watt solar panel, on a cloudy day.  The water does warm up a little, but that just means less heat needs to be added later.

Since polarity doesn't matter with this setup, I'll try AC in series with a small light bulb.  And I've been testing three other configurations made with these spirals, although this is the only unit which is not polarized.  The others act as a diode.

Speaking of ss, I'm going to use restaurant sauce cups for my Hydrogen fracturing column.

(https://s20.postimg.org/7r2t7pn3h/Sauce_Cups.jpg)

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2016, 08:55:54 am »
if you use a spiral shape cell you might add an external capacitor and see if you can hit resonance...

What is your purposr for these builds?


cheers

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2016, 21:56:54 pm »
wow , you live in the actual real desert . like apache territory coyotes ratlers etc ....

Ive tried coils etc also tried sheets of fuel filter gauze its like 100 x 100 holes per square inch = 10000 holes
I guess because of such small conductor theres no waste current in the centre of the conductor X section, its mostly surface area + direct contact with water

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2016, 23:55:00 pm »
if you use a spiral shape cell you might add an external capacitor and see if you can hit resonance...

What is your purposr for these builds?


cheers

When I first started this project, I just wanted a quick and easy electrolyzer to run my micro flame hho torch, to see if I can weld ss connecting wire to ss plates and cups.  I also have a delicate part on one of my carburetors which needs to be repaired.  And I often fantasize about using a tiny torch with a 3D printer, to print out metal objects, without NASA's expensive laser version.  Now that I'm into the project, I can see the advantage of being able to see the bubbles and the way they interact with the charges on the conductors.  When I get to the point of using an electron extraction circuit, the outer tube will need to be perforated on at least the side facing the third electrode.  So I built one cell with a third spiral between the two active ones.  I don't want the T spark effect to just go to one of the electrodes, but into the region between them.  The same will be true if I use Bruce Perreault's Glo-regulator as the single wire circuit, to pull out the electrons.   (Just the bottom part of the picture, with the 1J3 vacuum tube.)

(https://s20.postimg.org/x5ymjrk19/Glo_regulator.jpg)

I agree about using an external capacitor to adjust the resonance.  I'm planning to get a toy keyboard (electronic organ) so I'll have a variety of square wave frequencies to test.  (My guitar amps put out around 500V.  Or so I've read.)  The first cell I made was a modified inverted caduceus which has a built in resonance.  This is the one which has the diode effect - at least with salt as the dielectric.  The actual input electrode is in the very center and connects at the bottom.  I intend to explore this effect further in a couple of weeks when I get some more distilled water.  If I can get a transistor effect going, it'll be easy to adjust the gas output.

(https://s20.postimg.org/z0bh1i71p/Caduceus.jpg)

And I'm also going to test a cell with four electrodes, wired up like a C Stack.  Then the cell's capacitance, and resonance, will be adjustable by varying the potential on the outer spiral, relative to the inner most one.

wow , you live in the actual real desert . like apache territory coyotes ratlers etc ....

I'm in the eastern end of the Mohave desert.  The Apache girls are some of the most beautiful I've seen.  But around here, 35 miles from the Grand Canyon Sky Walk, it's mainly Haulapias.  (They own the Sky Walk.)  The rattlers here on the property are friendly enough.  At least the diamond backs and the coon tails.  I haven't seen a Mohave Green, but it's reputed that they attack on sight.  So I always stay tanked up on ground cumin (cumino), a spice from India which is an anti-toxin as well as a natural antibiotic.  The coyotes are a real nuisance.  One or more packs have been coming in two or three times every night here lately, trying to get my cats.  So I've been losing a lot of sleep.  I can always scare them off, but after a couple of hours, there they are again.

Quote
Ive tried coils etc also tried sheets of fuel filter gauze its like 100 x 100 holes per square inch = 10000 holes

I wonder if that gauze would work as a quenching circuit plate?  If it was wadded up and smashed down.

Quote
I guess because of such small conductor theres no waste current in the centre of the conductor X section, its mostly surface area + direct contact with water

You're probably right about this.  Even smaller wire seems better.  Like the scouring pad strands I used to 'string ball' wrap my caduceus top ball.  Gas just pours off the very edge where it's really sharp.  I'm also thinking about trying the super thin Tungsten wire in the electron gun I got from the Sharp copier I salvaged during the Great Sharp Copier Salvage of 2013, when everyone was doing it.

Cheers.

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2016, 00:31:46 am »
My computer crashed most of the way through my last message.  While retyping it, I forgot one thing I included the first time.

The way the bubbles are going into suspension, I'm thinking about aspirating some of that water and feeding it directly into my Injector.  Since it already has hho, it could be like having that much gasoline from a small cell.  There's been some work going around here lately with nano bubble ball lightning.  So I'll try hitting a small amount of the cloudy water with my BL spark.  Moray King thinks this could be the key to using water as an energy source, rather than as a fuel, although I have my own idea about where the energy comes from.  (Binding energy in the form of surface tension.  E=MC^2.)

http://rexresearch.com/kingmb/king.html

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2016, 05:14:21 am »


The way the bubbles are going into suspension, I'm thinking about aspirating some of that water and feeding it directly into my Injector.  Since it already has hho

having a one way valve for a watergas recirculation/overflow -much like a gasoline fuel rail-  inlet at the bottom separate from a line at the bottom for a water /gas mixture exit at the bottom ( the top of the cell being closed and sealed off) using gas pressure to in effect drain the cell was something of interest to me...of all the years searching I still can not find any literature in terms of the cloudy water.
I like what you are doing and look forward to where it takes you.
Thank you for sharing !
« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 14:51:32 pm by Burnhydroxy »

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2016, 18:16:10 pm »

having a one way valve for a watergas recirculation/overflow -much like a gasoline fuel rail-  inlet at the bottom separate from a line at the bottom for a water /gas mixture exit at the bottom ( the top of the cell being closed and sealed off) using gas pressure to in effect drain the cell was something of interest to me...of all the years searching I still can not find any literature in terms of the cloudy water.
I like what you are doing and look forward to where it takes you.
Thank you for sharing !

You've got some pretty good ideas and I appreciate your input.  Pulling the water/gas mixture out through a tube coming down sounds a lot better than trying to aspirate it out through the top.  I do remember seeing a picture of JL Naudin's cold fusion cell with cloudy water reflecting the light from the underwater arc.  The way all the bubbles are combining may have something to do with it.  I don't get the same effect with a separate rod at a distance, for the positive electrode.

http://jlnlabs.online.fr/cfr/index.htm

I've been doing a lot of work with my spirals.  There's even been some small exploding bubbles coming off the ball electrode, or else exploding before they leave the electrode's surface.  So far - in this voltage range - I can't see that the resulting tiny bubbles contain more gas by volume than the original bubble.  It may be that the Hydrogen Fracturing Process is a type of ion cascade, with impact dissociation, rather than Coulomb Explosions.  And the scouring pad wire has something on it that releases a lot of black crud into the water.

Using just the spirals, both contain the same length of wire when the outer one is made by wrapping it around a half inch pvc pipe.  Four inches seems to be the optimal length at this point, even with much smaller wire.

(https://s20.postimg.org/lbxroqnu5/Four_Inch_Spirals_sm.jpg)

Besides salt, a variety of electrolytes also work: vinegar, bleach, sulfamic acid (Lime-a-Way), and sodium hydroxide.  But that last one doesn't produce the cloudy water effect.  And the acid makes a foam on top.  All of these produce a loud bang from a 3/8" bubble.

I've also improved my construction technique.  Needle nose pliers can poke the wire through a piece of aquarium tubing.  The top one has to be installed at the bottom, then screwed all the way up.  This makes a much better spacer than using a hot glue gun.

Back to it.

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Re: Spiral Wire Electrodes
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2016, 03:29:52 am »
Thanks again for sharing !
I remember seeing an experiment titled 932 or something like that May interest you...it was dealing with that specific frequency, a spiral electrode and a specific acidic electrolyte. I'll try to find a link for it and send it to you.
It's a lot easier to load the hydrogen when the anode is further away
Using the spice bottle is genius and so much more convenient. ..thank you for sharing that,knowing if it leaks water upside down so much easier checking for gas leaks :)
I'm also interested in your tube arrangement. ...I have a lot of tubes and would love to learn how to use them.I have one in particular that looks like a switch inside if you don't mind me posting a picture.
sorry for not engaging topic specific my phone doesn't allow me see but what I'm typing making it difficult to stay focused