Author Topic: simple vic for learning purposes  (Read 10074 times)

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2011, 08:10:27 am »
thanks Steve,
 
I wont cut down my 11" cell, your right about referring back to it; i've been working on this for some time and this is my first real success! I'm working on designing a few smaller cells based on different theories. They wont be done for a few months because of my schedule.
As of now I'm just waiting for my high voltage probe for the scope to be shipped
Ok, man.
Lots of succes!

Steve

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2011, 09:58:52 am »
Gas production!
I changed some of the wiring for the inductors and got voltage to peak well over 1100 volts. Amp draw dropped as well! When the voltage went above 800 gas production started. It was the smallest amount and i can only see it if i look closely but its there! The chokes are a few heneries each, not sure on exact size. This experiment has sort of turned me into more of a believer. Using my first set of inductors i produced less voltage and had double the milliamp draw but zero production. This makes me want to believe that something other then just electrolysis is going on here  ;)   
Both experiments were done in tap water.   
I still dont have my scope working so no wave form to show yet.
I think I need to construct a better cell to test with, mine is 11 inches long and a cell half that size would probably be better for testing

Hi Dave.
Can you explain how you construct your last set of chokes please. ( what is core and how many turns per choke , wire diametr) Thanks Dave
good luck
andy

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2011, 00:08:52 am »
hello Andy
I started out trying to make two inductors out of a microwave oven transformer secondary like steve and Tony did. The first one I made I messed up pretty bad. They weren't even close to the same size haha. I learned from my mistake and made another one with both inductors pretty much equal. After a lot of testing with little results I decided to try the Mot secondary that I had messed up so bad. The difference between the size of the chokes is almost a ratio of 10 to 1, i didnt bother recording the exact value because I was planning on discarding it. I'll check what they are when I get home in a few weeks. 
 
I used the smaller inductor on the possitive side and the larger on the negative. This gave me about 600 volts across my cell.   
 I then connected the inductors as shown on the left side of the picture below; the voltage basicly doubled at resonance and a small stream of gas appeared!
 
I've been thinking about this for about a week now and I want to do many more tests when I have the time.
Please correct me if i'm wrong but this is how i see it. Having the smaller choke on the possitive gives me a good resonant fequency range that I can tune into; that impedance is canacled out. The larger inductor on the negative provided enough impedance to restricted amp flow and  allow voltage to hit the peak that it did.
 
I can get similar results from just using the primary and secondary of a microvave oven transformer, I should of just tried that first haha.
 Sorry for not giving any exact measurements besides voltage, I didn't record them and now I wont be home for about four more weeks; i will post them as soon as i can
 
ps, that picture isn't mine its just and example of how I hooked them up
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 00:57:29 am by Dave »

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2011, 00:38:36 am »
I've also made a few inductors from scratch but i didnt get nearly as good results as the simple methode posted above.

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2011, 02:04:03 am »
Guys,

I too have wrapped quite a few donuts, as experimental chokes, I like 4" toroids, everywhere from 2 henry to 8.   Anyway, you hit on something that I've been observing and working on and that is the choke wiring permutations.  You can shift much of the resonant waveform to the positive or the negative with the sizing of the neg and positive chokes.

for example, take any 110 to 12v or 24 volt transformer and connect it as a choke in the 8XA circuit, primary- one choke, secondary- 2nd choke.  you'll see that by switching the choke inputs and outputs, aiding or bucking waveforms at resonance and and lopesided wierd looking rose flower bulbs grow on the screen.  I find most gas production in this case happens when the smallest wave peak and trough that you can dial to is made into a more perfect smooth tooth by tiny adjustments.  It looks like a jagged capital "A" and turns into a more smooth A and the most gas is produced. 

$.02

kickbackemf


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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2011, 09:04:10 am »
Dave and Kick
Thank You for your input and clarification.
Good luck
andy

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2011, 16:40:46 pm »
Kickback, thats really intersting. I cant wait to see mine on the scope. Does the wave form shift towards the possitve with a larger choke on the negative? or is it the other way around?
 
In all of stans documents I remember reading that the chokes were similar but he didnt say they were the same. Maybe they could be the same, but the wiper arm suggests they aren't.
 
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 17:01:27 pm by Dave »

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Re: simple vic for learning purposes
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2011, 01:33:49 am »
Dave,

You've probably answered your question by now with a tranny. i'd have to look again,  anyhoooo   it appears to still be a trade off with volts for amps relative to gas production, you may run some nice high voltages in the kv range and still not make any gas until you slip a few milliamps in the mix, this can be done by first running up your voltage and then lowering your frequency until the tranny gargles some and the nice waveform bulb gets choppy...

getting gas with near zero amps may be possible... i can't do it

btw, I use 15 ppm tds nearly mineral ion free reverse osmosis water to try to prove this phenomenon

watt for watt though, going straight from the variac 8XA full bridge direct to the cell with out chokes produces much more gas 

kb