Author Topic: The Ewok Method  (Read 8513 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 106
The Ewok Method
« on: December 16, 2009, 04:25:19 am »
Well been posting here for a little while now and i though that i would post some details on my plan.

Anyone who read my guff on "ou".com would know I rescently had a smoker destroy more than a small portion of my lungs... My project, about a grand worth of equipment and a meter in diameter in my roof. Good news is i am all done on repairs to the roof and replacing the tools is coming along nicely.

As for my project...
Before the demise of my previous work i was experimenting with a few things on a tube cell array. This is what i have come up with;
Test cell of 7 set of SS 316L tubes at 140mm ea. Gap between inner and outter tube is approx 1mm. Bottom of the outter tube has a semi circle cut on opposite sides, This is to allow waterflow from the bottom. These are set out and connected in paralel inside the old PVC piping. Nothing new. Note - Spacing between the sets must exceed 1cm from all other sets. There is a brace twards the top of the sets to hold the them in place, This is also where the connection to the out tubes will take place.
At the base a plastic disc will be set to create a water tight chamber. Holes cut to snugly fit the inner tube in then sealed so no water can pass. Inner tubes to be sead approx 2-3cm from base with a water tight sealant to allow room to make the connection to the inner tubes from under neeth.

Process:
With this all set out and only using 12 - 14.8v (car voltages) at a max of 15 amp (aiming for 10amp) i intend to mark out and post HHO output with these variables. This i hope will help people in their larger builds.
Straight dc from the battery :- 14.8v & 12v @ 10amp and at 15amp (control numbers)
Pulsed using a modified PWM :- Still only using 14.8v & 12v with different duty cycles and possibly different frequencies (budget dependant)
HV conversion :- Boosting the voltage up to 100kv difference in a stepped manner also cycling through different duty cycles and frequencies (dielectric breakdown of water occurs at ~70Kv per mm, avalanche effect should start at ~80-85Kv per mm) This will wipe out most of my Amps by converting them into Volts.
If the HV field application shows promise i will further my experiments into this idea with the addition of using 1mm thick fibre optic strands as the seal at the bottom of my cell and "fireing" laser lights into the cell directly to attempt to "flood" the field with excess electrons.
Other advancements considered have been an ultra this layer of teflon on the reactive sides of the tubes to prevent electron transfer between the plates and the water, The hope here is if a chain of diodes can maintain the massive voltage field to accelerate the electrons in it to do the work then the input energy would only be the laser and small bursts to maintain any losses in field strength.

With the small scale of my experiment i should be able to eliminate any useless ideas, also i may be able to illuminate possible ways to increase the production of current cells.

Will update as i proceed...



Offline Login to see usernames

  • 50+
  • *
  • Posts: 68
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2009, 04:29:20 am »
Sounds like a great project Ewok

Online Login to see usernames

  • Administrator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4441
    • water structure and science
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2009, 09:43:47 am »
Well been posting here for a little while now and i though that i would post some details on my plan.

Anyone who read my guff on "ou".com would know I rescently had a smoker destroy more than a small portion of my lungs... My project, about a grand worth of equipment and a meter in diameter in my roof. Good news is i am all done on repairs to the roof and replacing the tools is coming along nicely.

As for my project...
Before the demise of my previous work i was experimenting with a few things on a tube cell array. This is what i have come up with;
Test cell of 7 set of SS 316L tubes at 140mm ea. Gap between inner and outter tube is approx 1mm. Bottom of the outter tube has a semi circle cut on opposite sides, This is to allow waterflow from the bottom. These are set out and connected in paralel inside the old PVC piping. Nothing new. Note - Spacing between the sets must exceed 1cm from all other sets. There is a brace twards the top of the sets to hold the them in place, This is also where the connection to the out tubes will take place.
At the base a plastic disc will be set to create a water tight chamber. Holes cut to snugly fit the inner tube in then sealed so no water can pass. Inner tubes to be sead approx 2-3cm from base with a water tight sealant to allow room to make the connection to the inner tubes from under neeth.

Process:
With this all set out and only using 12 - 14.8v (car voltages) at a max of 15 amp (aiming for 10amp) i intend to mark out and post HHO output with these variables. This i hope will help people in their larger builds.
Straight dc from the battery :- 14.8v & 12v @ 10amp and at 15amp (control numbers)
Pulsed using a modified PWM :- Still only using 14.8v & 12v with different duty cycles and possibly different frequencies (budget dependant)
HV conversion :- Boosting the voltage up to 100kv difference in a stepped manner also cycling through different duty cycles and frequencies (dielectric breakdown of water occurs at ~70Kv per mm, avalanche effect should start at ~80-85Kv per mm) This will wipe out most of my Amps by converting them into Volts.
If the HV field application shows promise i will further my experiments into this idea with the addition of using 1mm thick fibre optic strands as the seal at the bottom of my cell and "fireing" laser lights into the cell directly to attempt to "flood" the field with excess electrons.
Other advancements considered have been an ultra this layer of teflon on the reactive sides of the tubes to prevent electron transfer between the plates and the water, The hope here is if a chain of diodes can maintain the massive voltage field to accelerate the electrons in it to do the work then the input energy would only be the laser and small bursts to maintain any losses in field strength.

With the small scale of my experiment i should be able to eliminate any useless ideas, also i may be able to illuminate possible ways to increase the production of current cells.

Will update as i proceed...

Nice to hear that you are back in business, Ewok.
Keep writing your progress. We like to read it!

My personal opinion is that only HV will not work.
My theory is that you need some amps flowing to align the watermolecules and then hit it with HV.
That way we should we able to ring some molecules.

Steve






Offline Login to see usernames

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 106
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2010, 06:33:41 am »
As i have started to be active with posting again i better update on this.

Since initial post my trusted electronics shop has managed to order in the wrong kit 3 times... (note to everyone on this site if the new guy stuff up your order talk to the manager, don't give him another chance...) These kits come in via sea and has items in them not stocked on the shelf... sigh

I have gone through 3x trials of the HV diode set up, i am left with some serious arcing or blown diodes... but still pushing along.

I do have some interesting points to contribute though. HHO gas has a higher dielectric breakdown point than air itself, this is also dependant on the quality of the water. (do not put tap water in greater than 60kv/mm, you will need to replace your cell, or at min the electrodes) I have been advised by "Anonomys" not to bother with the coating on the electrodes, with this thought i am looking into the price of teflon coating closely. I have also been enquiring with local powder coaters and electrical engineers as to alternatives. Seems that 100kv is an unusual request !!! :o

Also i am looking into new possible HV power supplies as my parter has voiced her concerns with my Tesla coil array. At some point she researched it and saw all those pretty discharge photo's and got concerned... ATM i am considering something like the Ignition coil set up with some modifacations. Anyone with any ideas would be welcome, note that large amounts of transformers or 1 large one are out (as per the Tesla Coil setup).

HHO Production has been good, nothing to report on amounts as even at 15 V there was almost 0 production, and PWM is still in the process. To those about to correct me or to advise electrolyte adding, I am using home distilled filtered rain water. As its composition is not set it is also extremely non conductive (till you hit about 70kv as expected then it isn't all that spectacular)...

More to Follow...

Online Login to see usernames

  • Administrator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4441
    • water structure and science
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2010, 10:23:54 am »
Thank you for the update Ewok  ;)
Welcome to the club of blowing up components and the Inventor club of finding 1000 ways that will not work as we hoped for..... ;)

I can understand your partner feelings about a Tsla coil setup too....

You be carefull.

Steve

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 106
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2010, 07:19:24 am »
Well as an update i have to relocate outside as the kids were caught playing with the min VDG machine and zapping each other with static electricity... So with this in mind (and the winter season upon my country) progress is slow...

More to come as i need to verify some findings that destroyed my "Teslar coil" generator.

Online Login to see usernames

  • Administrator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4441
    • water structure and science
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2010, 11:28:12 am »
Well as an update i have to relocate outside as the kids were caught playing with the min VDG machine and zapping each other with static electricity... So with this in mind (and the winter season upon my country) progress is slow...

More to come as i need to verify some findings that destroyed my "Teslar coil" generator.

Ok, man. Keep yr kids save at all time....
However, playing with a VDG is fun for them as well.... ;)



Offline Login to see usernames

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 106
Re: The Ewok Method
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2010, 06:27:38 am »
Ok hit a small snag... or could be a blessing in diguise. Cell works nicely. Not done any actual production testing but phenomenon and a theory that you can all disect rip apart and then tell me what has really happened.
Ok set up is the same as described above and there is a whopping HV converter coutesy of an electronics nut friend of mine, he claim max out put at about 150k volts, i think its closer to 110kv maybe 105kv, still far more than i need!!! hook the cell up nice steady production for about 30secs, then there is like a wave where production goes up about 5 fold (caught me by surprise the first time!!!) then nothing for a few secs.
Now the first few times we completely destroyed some Diodes (and HV diode arrays). I have been informed that i will be paying for those and it was cause by BEMF. Using his and my observations and knowledge of what is happening we have come up with the following. The steady production is the plates charging and charging with the  amount of leakage causing the production. Then when the tubes/water can no longer hold anymore charge there is a cascade of power that flows from one to the other (massive flow of power is where my "5x" production came from) now the then nothing is the plates recharging to cycle again. I got my avalanche effect in the bag.

Now to make this a serious find i need to get atleast 5 LPM from no more than 120 watts right? From some improvements and some possible modifactions i feel i can blow this number out of the water with no electrolyte. Well that is the current standing anyway.