Author Topic: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!  (Read 4079 times)

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Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« on: October 21, 2009, 00:13:40 am »
I've been thinking about this for a while and can see where I am lacking some fundamental principals.
So far I have not seen anyone locally here using a current probe attached to the o'scope.
This has to deal with efficiency, and its a fundamental problem we all have been dealing with in one way or another.
I'll try to explain: if a capacitor lags the voltage up to 90 degree's and a inductor coil lags the current up to 90 degree's and the resonant point is when the voltage and current are in phase at the peak.

A basic line diagram of a voltage sinewave would show this well.
A sinewave on a line full 360 degree's.
Now add a current wave to this and if its not in phase with the voltage wave it will draw much more current further out from the phase peak relationship with the voltage.
It can draw quite a bit more current when out of phase.

If you had a current probe for your o'scopes you can see the relationship of volt to current phase.
Now if you made a capacitor bank and maybe small contactors on a switch bank you can adjust the capacitance of the waveform until its in resonance with the current wave.
At this point it will draw the least current.
Maybe the same with switching inductors depends on the circuit whether capacitive or inductive.

This method may help in achieving a resonant condition of the signal waveform. And also tell you what value you need for each cap or inductor depending on your electrodes that are being used. And further more relate to the size length of wire and type of VIC transformer you make.

Don't know if this is helpfull in design for HHO electrodes but the more you think about it, it makes some sense to acheive this efficiency and directly relates to resonant condition.

Let me know if I'm thinking wrong here guys, this is the easiest way I can think and picture what we are making and using.     

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Re: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2009, 00:30:54 am »
Yes , a current probe is most useful ,  how  much are they ?? I dont even have one ..

Right now I wanna test out maximum tube vibration with a Hydrophone , wich is not so expensive .

If it vibrates with the signal , I can pick up a maxium vibration frequency .

ROFL this is the Steve number , post number 1001

As you said to me , the  bubbles dont stick as much when you vibrate the tubes .

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Re: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2009, 09:38:09 am »
You can make your own current probe, if you want.
Check that on google. Its pretty simple.

Steve

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Re: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2009, 16:37:30 pm »
Here's a link I found for a RF current probe:
http://www.seed-solutions.com/gregordy/Amateur%20Radio/Experimentation/RFProbe.htm#Construction Details

Looks pretty easy but don't know if we can use this exact item.
Its just for reference anyway and may work.

Anyone else with links for easy current probes please post your link.

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Re: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2009, 18:25:39 pm »
Ok good news , I dont have to spend more $ on this , Its getting pretty expensive .

This will be useful for tuning , you can see the effect of w/e component you just changed on the scope .

Because its all about the tuning .

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Re: Voltage & Current Resonant Fundamentals for Dummies!
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2009, 22:02:38 pm »
I was reading to see what could be the maximum operating frequency of an alternator , a 30,000 rpm alternator doesnt exit and a drive motor that goes @ such speeds would require 10 kw .

I am now 100% sure that an alternator wasnt used in the Stephen Meyers app , besides being 20 times under-efficient vs solid state wave-shaping , it cannot go higher than 60 hz . SM was using a 500 hz frequency . , that is  29000 rpm ...


I was reading to see what could be the maximum operating frequency of an alternator , a 30,000 rpm alternator doesnt exit and a drive motor that goes @ such speeds would require 10 kw .

I am now 100% sure that an alternator wasnt used in the Stephen Meyers app , besides being 20 times under-efficient vs solid state wave-shaping , it cannot go higher than 60 hz . SM was using a 500 hz frequency . , that is  29000 rpm ...



http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.web-books.com/eLibrary/Engineering/Circuits/AC/02426.png&imgrefurl=http://www.web-books.com/eLibrary/Engineering/Circuits/AC/AC_13P2.htm&usg=__v0gBLwQ5YormTtLxa-Tae5MuvLY=&h=233&w=372&sz=25&hl=fr&start=3&um=1&tbnid=vqNGAVwfjIcpOM:&tbnh=76&tbnw=122&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dalternator%2B60%2Bhz%2B3600%2Brpm%26hl%3Dfr%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1