Ionizationx: a clean environment is a human right!

Stanley Meyer => Stanley Meyer => Cracked!!!!! => Topic started by: Steve on June 23, 2008, 22:31:30 pm

Title: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 23, 2008, 22:31:30 pm
Finally!
Someone did it  and published his art!

http://jnaudin.free.fr/wfc/index.htm

Go all and replicate this. This man is a genius!
 :D :D :D :D

Br
Steve

Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 00:04:52 am
looks kinda close to  his but i didnt insulate my electrode   i wonder what his gas output is  i found that the only thing resonance did was drop the voltage and ampreage needed to produce the same amount of gas   it didnt give me any more gas just super efficiancy   my wave here was at 50hz to 60 hz
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 02:31:40 am
guys how feasible will it be for laymen to build this setup

here is the thing as i have stated before we have to get this out to the common folks most people cant scrounge up all the electronics and parts needed for a build, myself included, however with a little help we can form an "alliance" to get this stuff out. i will give my resources to further the effort i:e: time and money

stevie and the rest of the jedi council i realize that it may take some time for u guys to assemble the unit and make a tutorial but please hurry i need the relief in my own tank and a lot of other folks do 2, i am spending $250-$300 a week onb gas right now and its goin up, both the prices and the amount of driving that i do, ive got about 6 coworkers in the same boat sooooo.....         we are dish installers.
 

btw i havent seen anymore on the leds and stuff to change the state of the gas is this still a needed component?
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 03:04:22 am
smack booster and a pond fogger would give you some instant relief  for a couple hundred dollars  you could build one and install it in less than a week  if your real motivated
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 05:52:18 am
This is not all of stan meyer and his work has yet to be fully "cracked"

I do have a question about JNaudin's insulated tube if he could describe it in more detail.
Does he come to this forum?
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 06:58:33 am
What the guy is saying is he cracked water with little or hardly any amps at all with high voltage, he says the gas does not look like much but when you measure its output for some reason its rediculusly high!

Steve is emailing him, i ask for him to find his production, and transformer type. The information on that page has been backed up and saved and if the guy seems to be legit it will be tested, "not by me", i have to much on my hands right now, and i dont have the money to test every device someone claims to be overunity.

My point of  view is if You, or That Guy made water resonate with high voltage and low amps then this is something stan didn't do, therfor your the one that deserves the pat on the back. But this is just my point of view. I have tested this technology Long enough to understand stan LOVED his amp flow to his cell, matter of fact he could get more amps to the cell than we can, how he does it? im still working on it. But high volts low amps, you gots to prove me wrong, i say it cant be done, and i say stan didn't do this but his way of distraction! Anyways, you guys have the rest of your life to prove me wrong with using high voltage low amps to crack water, if you succeed i wouldn't be suprised.

I will end this post by saying, Test Report of Evaulation Page 60... 12.5 Volts 40 Amps 500 Watts 7 liters a Min. Now thats 4.4 amps per tube, 55 watts per tube.

Can you make 1 tube consume 4.4 amps with olmost an 8th inch gap?
How was that high volts low amps?
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 08:36:36 am
i look forward to what you have to offer h2opower....no one ever seems to want to hear anything differnet then the general populous.....for some reason certain events have been hushing the people on the soapboxes.......and hydrocars, i do not know as to why your thought process has turned to a destructive path in stanley meyers work....lets not stomp our feet and declare sour grapes.
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 08:57:28 am
right on h20! yes it may be sad, but i have a path just like you do. I have been so far into stans work i cant even begin to explain to anyone the facts so i don't bother. I can understand why you would think that stan used high voltage low amps, for one this is a big problem, because if stan used high voltage low amps, and if he did find the resonate Freq of wator than he never would have had that big clunky alternator on his dune buggy to start with, nor the clunky driver motor or that clunky rotory converter.

i pointed out that stans "tube" consumes 4.4 amps per tube, 40 amps for all 9 tubes and it is also in his test of evaulation. I am currently working on "how to make them tubes consume that while others are busy on the chase for resonation", they dont yet realize how hard it is to make a tube with such a gap consume that,  and to be honest i've done a pretty damn good job at doing it... So far i have ran an engine on as little as 500 cc's a min by ionizing the gas just like stan did, and herman, converting good ol 1h to 2h.. so basicly stan and herman did the same thing when making isotop hydrogen, when you read the patents you have to kinda read between the lines, when herman refers to 2h hard water he is actually meaning hydrogen with neutrons in it, which is 2h, just what stan used. the problem is the 2H is not volitile like gasoline but like deisel, this is where herman used Xrays and stan lasers, they both altered the gas and stans methode was the vic, this is where you're seeing high voltage low amps with resonate frequencies, the gas charges, it dont cost anything to ionize the gas.

now i've pointed out the test on page 60, and there is enough information there "math" ,"definitions", how too's on that page for you to actually replicate The test of stans in which he is explaining by using a 1 liter cavity. in which where stan produced 7 liters a min using a 1 liter cavity where 1 psi is = to 1 liter of hydroxy is "impossible", how do i know? well i tested it and confirmed it was impossible, this means if stan would have told the truth in that test of evaluation then his work would have been easily cracked, this is why he hollared 7 liters a min, but sadly when you use the math and conduct the test it tells no lie. My ideals and road of direction is based on facts, what was left behind and what is as well as what is possible and what is not possible.

I respect the ones thats trying to find the resonate freq of wator, if they succeed then they will be the wator gods! But im sorry to hear you think stan broke water with resonance and at the same time im happy that you're working on breaking water with resonance.  anyhow, this is no longer my forum, i chose to step down while the destraction was at work. i'm already making ways to do the possible.

if i have come across harsh in any way then honestly i do not mean to, sometimes my way of wording is not that great, i am just getting across to you that i am not on the same road your on, eventually when people do start to realize what is what, i might not be around.

god bless your tubes man.

Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 09:05:44 am
i look forward to what you have to offer h2opower....no one ever seems to want to hear anything differnet then the general populous.....for some reason certain events have been hushing the people on the soapboxes.......and hydrocars, i do not know as to why your thought process has turned to a destructive path in stanley meyers work....lets not stomp our feet and declare sour grapes.

it hasn't, i just understand what you dont.
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 09:06:09 am
whos forum is this now?
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 09:12:24 am
i look forward to what you have to offer h2opower....no one ever seems to want to hear anything differnet then the general populous.....for some reason certain events have been hushing the people on the soapboxes.......and hydrocars, i do not know as to why your thought process has turned to a destructive path in stanley meyers work....lets not stomp our feet and declare sour grapes.

it hasn't, i just understand what you dont.

you might have just overlooked something.
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 10:04:44 am
Stevie, I think SeaMonkey was right
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 10:17:20 am
i look forward to what you have to offer h2opower....no one ever seems to want to hear anything differnet then the general populous.....for some reason certain events have been hushing the people on the soapboxes.......and hydrocars, i do not know as to why your thought process has turned to a destructive path in stanley meyers work....lets not stomp our feet and declare sour grapes.

it hasn't, i just understand what you dont.

you might have just overlooked something.

yeah, i dont understand, im usually slow minded...
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 10:58:50 am
Now that I had some time to look at JNaudin's work I did notice that the bifilar coil was hooked up wrong, the points 3,4 are in reverse of Stanley Meyer's so that would mean that they are fighting each other and not sharing the magnetic field.


br,
h2opower.

Read the first 10 pages of the Technical brief, i think thats where its at. you will see stan told you to hook your chokes up in reverse as you say, its almost like he was making a joke.
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 19:29:24 pm
Hi guys !

Everyone know the operating system which came from the first name of a Finlandish guy. In France, we'd got ours national guy for this system too. He took it from version 0.0.26, if I remember correctly, his name was René Cougnenc. He suicide himself in the middle 90's, for personal reasons, nothing to do with computing but it cast a chill over the French L???'s community. When I first discover jlnlabs.org, we were on late 2001, it helps me in many kinds. Il follow his site since.

First, there's any lies in jlnlabs.org of anykind : never !
Second, he's not a genius but he really seems to be a bulldog in his work : I hope to meet him one day. Life will answer.

If Mister Jean-Louis Naudin gaves his Meyer's researches : they're true. Nothing else. So, don't waste your time to verify.
Daff
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 19:42:08 pm
So, the first shockwave is done.
How about that.....

Sure many of us had similair results.
But i never had any results with an insulated innertube.
I had too the step-up waveform reproduced.
But i think JN is showing a very good direction here.
I will make a new topic for JN  replications.
Hydrocars is still making a point. You still need some quantitys of gas to run a car. For sure stan meyer had different systems.
And for sure we still need to change the state of the gas..
If anybody can add improvements to JN,s work, then please do so.
For myself, i have to digest all this info for the next view days. But i am thinking about to make a replication, soon. I have most of the stuff in the house.....

br
steve














Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 23:17:09 pm
It appears all of my previous posts were lost so I will reiterate my thoughts and observations about where the current is coming from to split the water.

When JNL is talking about resonance, it is not the resonance of the water itself (although the water does play the role of a dielectric). It is the resonance between the inductor(bifilar chokes) and the capacitor(a dielectric between two conductors in this case being water between 2 tubes with the cathode insulated to create a water capacitor). Note also by definition the chokes and the stepup transformer act as capacitors as well. A dielectric( magnet wire insulation and air) between conductors (the copper coil windings). Not only is the water charging, the inductors are acting like capacitors and charging to a higher voltage as well.

When in resonance, the secondary circuit resonates at double the frequency of the primary (It would look similar to full wave rectified ac). The rise of the positive primary pulse produces a voltage in the secondary. When the primary pulse drops, another pulse is generated. The diode forces the second pulse to be positive. At resonance this essencially maintains a steady positive potential on the secondary part of the circuit allowing the inductors and capacitor to charge. Once the pulse train is stopped, the inductors release their charge into the capacitor and then the capacitor discharges from a high potential to low potential. The diode and the chokes prevent current flow so the charge is dissipated within the water itself in the form of Amps (electron cascade?). This effect is corroborated by Tom Beardon when he speaks of a degenerate semiconductor circuit (quoted below). So it appears Meyer is using the principle of unipolar positive pulses without current to charge a capacitor to achive overunity.

Dr. Lindeman describes it as a catastrophic dielectric failure within the WFC, where voltage potential is changed to AMPS. I disagree with the "catastrophic dielectric failure" part but I agree that the potential is changed to AMPS. Dielectric failure would imply a dead short taking the shortest path through the dielectric from one conductor to the other. Instead, this appears to be a longitudinal flow of current through the water, not a direct flow between conductors.

Quote from an email by Tom Beardon to JNL.
Quote
Another way of looking at the switched degenerate semiconductor circuit is that one charges it with voltage only, completely statically, with no j(phi) current permitted during "excitation" or "potentialization". One then switches the voltage source away, having drawn only potential from it and not power, and the circuit then changes itself and dissipates this excess "static" energy in the load, by automatically converting itself into a normal dynamic conducting circuit as the electrons "relax" and move as current.



Now the two (supposedly) most successful devices are Meyer's cell and Boyce's cell. Although they both produce overunity results, they appear to work in opposite manners and do not produce the same quantities and quality of of gas. JNL stated at resonance a sinificant amount of gas was being generated but the bubbles were very fine. Boyce states the gas production in his setup is so vigorous it looks like it is at a furious boil.

Meyer prevents current flow and extracts electrons using a unipolar positive high voltage field and breaks the water into gas. But due to the shortage of electrons, the gasses are most likely predominately diatomic hydrogen and oxygen.  This may be why he uses laser injection to break the diatomic gases into monatomic gasses. They would not stay in monatomic form very long with the shortage of electrons. This is similar to the Hydrogen welding torch from the 1930's where H2 gas was passed thru a 300V AC arc between two tungsten electrodes to break it up into it's monatomic form where it would recombine on contact with the material being welded releasing a huge amount of heat in the process. It appears In both Meyer's and the Hydrogen welding torch setups, the gas has to be used immediately upon creation of monatomic form of the gas.

Conversely, Boyce allows current to flow and in addition applies a unipolar positive pulsed high voltage (but not as high as Meyer). Boyce has stated he believes the excess of electrons provided by the DC bias current, prevents the recombination of the gases from monatomic to diatomic form since the atoms have all of the electrons they need to be electrically neutral so they don't need to share any electrons with the other atoms. He commented that he had to switch from using SS tubing to plastic tubing between the cell and the LPG carb because he kept getting shocks whenever he touched the SS tubing. He attributed this to the excess of electrons present in the gas.

Now the part I like the most about Meyer's setup is the fact it does not need an electrolyte. That KOH or NaOH is nasty stuff to work with. If Meyer's cell blew up you would probably get wet, but if Boyce's popped, you would not olny get wet, you would be burned by the caustic electrolyte.

Now if you could separate the H2 from O2 coming out of Meyer's cell and pass the separated H2 thru an arc then it may be more viable. Once example of gas separation was in the Zach West Electrolyser design where he had a bubbler with a partial baffle and had electromagnets with steel cores on either side of the bubbler to pull the H2 away from the O2 as it passed thru the bubbler.

There are drawinga of Zach's bubbler/separator in Chapter 10 of Patrick Kelly's Practical Guide to Free-energy devices on pages 59, 62, 64, 70 and 71.

What would happen if the extracted diatomic gasses were passed thru a negative voltage field after it leaves Meyer's cell? Would they recombine into water or would they take on the extra electrons and separate into monatomic form?


Going back to Beardon's quote, if the pulse charged capacitor was switched to discharge into a regular electrolysys cell with an electrolyte, this would inherently be overunity electrolysys and you could also generate the H2 and O2 separately above their respective electrodes. If you charge the capacitors to high voltage, the discharge could be switched into a primary winding of a stepdown transformer amplifying the current and keeping the voltage low around 1.5V for a single large cell.

Combining the good parts of the different systems may work nicely.


Comments?
Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 24, 2008, 23:53:59 pm
What the guy is saying is he cracked water with little or hardly any amps at all with high voltage, he says the gas does not look like much but when you measure its output for some reason its rediculusly high!

Steve is emailing him, i ask for him to find his production, and transformer type. The information on that page has been backed up and saved and if the guy seems to be legit it will be tested, "not by me", i have to much on my hands right now, and i dont have the money to test every device someone claims to be overunity.

My point of  view is if You, or That Guy made water resonate with high voltage and low amps then this is something stan didn't do, therfor your the one that deserves the pat on the back. But this is just my point of view. I have tested this technology Long enough to understand stan LOVED his amp flow to his cell, matter of fact he could get more amps to the cell than we can, how he does it? im still working on it. But high volts low amps, you gots to prove me wrong, i say it cant be done, and i say stan didn't do this but his way of distraction! Anyways, you guys have the rest of your life to prove me wrong with using high voltage low amps to crack water, if you succeed i wouldn't be suprised.

I will end this post by saying, Test Report of Evaulation Page 60... 12.5 Volts 40 Amps 500 Watts 7 liters a Min. Now thats 4.4 amps per tube, 55 watts per tube.

Can you make 1 tube consume 4.4 amps with olmost an 8th inch gap?
How was that high volts low amps?



After some extensive testing I agree with hydrocars on this one.  Stan had 9 tubes 18 inches long perhaps that was why he was drawing 40 amps. Stevie has super long tubes.

Stevie Can you let us know:

  • How many tubes you had in your super tall cell?

     what was the maximum amps you got your cell to draw regardless of voltage?

    What was the maximum amp draw at 12 volts?

  • I dont buy Naudins replication. The clip is way too short and sped up at least 60% of its original speed. Please pay close attention to the way the small bubbles form and rise and you will clearly see the video is sped up.

    I get gas like naudins if i use a PWM at 12 volts 0.8 amps distilled water however my inner tubes are not coated.

    If this is a major breakthrough then it has way too little information for anyone to test or verify.

    I vote that presumptous link  stanley meyers work cracked be taken down until this replication is confirmed by the public at large.

    Perhaps possible stanley meyer crack will be appropriate instead of the line used now.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 01:49:31 am
    i second the vote to change the presumptious name of this post

    i also vote for me to stop wasting my time reading all this extremely technical stuff and wasting all of the jedi councils time with my silly inquiries and comments

    its just too deep for dummies like me, i think you guys would benefit greatly from using  this forum as astepping stone to an "inner circle" of those in the know because honestly folks like myself are just wasting server space......and youre time

    good luck on the work and i will keep an eye on you all for a feasible buld that i can complete myself

    the object that we should all keep in mind is liberation from the oppression of oil, global liberation that is
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 02:10:35 am
     Is this for real,  is the work for wfc finished?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 02:19:29 am
    Actually I think it is just getting started... this is the 1st time I saw breaking water with isolated tube...

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 04:27:38 am
    h2o power,

     i am pretty much in line with u.high voltage.i tried the coated cathode about two months ago. there is some validity to it.if u check your voltage at the wfc while it is running, u will see that there is a lot less voltage drop as compared to an uncoated cathode, even if the uncoated cat. is in distilled water! this does mean the cell can step up voltage instead of shorting to the anode.

    stan slipped up in one of his conferences, he mentioned the vale of voltage he was putting into the CHOKES let alone the wfc. he mentioned his toroidal transformer was putting out 20,000 volts!!

    my dad is a retired electrician  and is helping me out with this thing. he, as per my advice, wrapped a plastic tube with mag. wire as to simulate the coated cathode. than used a microwave transformer with the pwm and a relay to charge up the cell. of course he also used the chokes and diodes as per d-14 or stan. he just wanted to see if higher voltage would work. he got 220 volts at the cell with it running! the cell really didn't zap too much voltage. this is the kicker, he said the cell produced at least half as much hho as if he ran two ss tubes strait off the battery!! remember, this is with the inner cathode completely insulated!! and also technically a large coil...hmmm.

    imagine 20,000 volts, just a thought. if the cathode is insulated, the wfc wouldn't zap the voltage no matter what type of water u use! ya think maybe stan insulated his cathodes?? i noticed as i doubled my secondary windings on my toroid, the production on the INSULATED cathode set also seemed to double.

    some said that stan was cautious of people looking close at his wfc....what do ya think?

    i am wright on board with your thinking, don't get discouraged, keep sending your info. something will happen we ALL will get it .some way or another!!

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 07:54:48 am
    hrmmm,,,, anyone up for crayons and a barney video?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 15:12:26 pm
    What the guy is saying is he cracked water with little or hardly any amps at all with high voltage, he says the gas does not look like much but when you measure its output for some reason its rediculusly high!

    Steve is emailing him, i ask for him to find his production, and transformer type. The information on that page has been backed up and saved and if the guy seems to be legit it will be tested, "not by me", i have to much on my hands right now, and i dont have the money to test every device someone claims to be overunity.

    My point of  view is if You, or That Guy made water resonate with high voltage and low amps then this is something stan didn't do, therfor your the one that deserves the pat on the back. But this is just my point of view. I have tested this technology Long enough to understand stan LOVED his amp flow to his cell, matter of fact he could get more amps to the cell than we can, how he does it? im still working on it. But high volts low amps, you gots to prove me wrong, i say it cant be done, and i say stan didn't do this but his way of distraction! Anyways, you guys have the rest of your life to prove me wrong with using high voltage low amps to crack water, if you succeed i wouldn't be suprised.

    I will end this post by saying, Test Report of Evaulation Page 60... 12.5 Volts 40 Amps 500 Watts 7 liters a Min. Now thats 4.4 amps per tube, 55 watts per tube.

    Can you make 1 tube consume 4.4 amps with olmost an 8th inch gap?
    How was that high volts low amps?



    After some extensive testing I agree with hydrocars on this one.  Stan had 9 tubes 18 inches long perhaps that was why he was drawing 40 amps. Stevie has super long tubes.

    Stevie Can you let us know:

  • How many tubes you had in your super tall cell?

     what was the maximum amps you got your cell to draw regardless of voltage?

    What was the maximum amp draw at 12 volts?



  • Katz:

    I have 10 tubes of 24 inches in my wfc.
    It is pulling 20 amps by 12V with tapwater
    My gap is 2mm
    The totall amount of amps this cell can pull is depending on voltage. Higher volts, mean higher amps.
    For sure there is a limit to that, but cannot say how high that is..

    br
    Steve

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 15:16:11 pm
    i second the vote to change the presumptious name of this post

    i also vote for me to stop wasting my time reading all this extremely technical stuff and wasting all of the jedi councils time with my silly inquiries and comments

    its just too deep for dummies like me, i think you guys would benefit greatly from using  this forum as astepping stone to an "inner circle" of those in the know because honestly folks like myself are just wasting server space......and youre time

    good luck on the work and i will keep an eye on you all for a feasible buld that i can complete myself

    the object that we should all keep in mind is liberation from the oppression of oil, global liberation that is

    Jared,

    I hope that at the end of all this talking of us, you will benifid from it. There must a setup there that you can use to replicate at the end.

    br
    Steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 15:22:20 pm
    h2o power,

     i am pretty much in line with u.high voltage.i tried the coated cathode about two months ago. there is some validity to it.if u check your voltage at the wfc while it is running, u will see that there is a lot less voltage drop as compared to an uncoated cathode, even if the uncoated cat. is in distilled water! this does mean the cell can step up voltage instead of shorting to the anode.

    stan slipped up in one of his conferences, he mentioned the vale of voltage he was putting into the CHOKES let alone the wfc. he mentioned his toroidal transformer was putting out 20,000 volts!!

    my dad is a retired electrician  and is helping me out with this thing. he, as per my advice, wrapped a plastic tube with mag. wire as to simulate the coated cathode. than used a microwave transformer with the pwm and a relay to charge up the cell. of course he also used the chokes and diodes as per d-14 or stan. he just wanted to see if higher voltage would work. he got 220 volts at the cell with it running! the cell really didn't zap too much voltage. this is the kicker, he said the cell produced at least half as much hho as if he ran two ss tubes strait off the battery!! remember, this is with the inner cathode completely insulated!! and also technically a large coil...hmmm.

    imagine 20,000 volts, just a thought. if the cathode is insulated, the wfc wouldn't zap the voltage no matter what type of water u use! ya think maybe stan insulated his cathodes?? i noticed as i doubled my secondary windings on my toroid, the production on the INSULATED cathode set also seemed to double.

    some said that stan was cautious of people looking close at his wfc....what do ya think?

    i am wright on board with your thinking, don't get discouraged, keep sending your info. something will happen we ALL will get it .some way or another!!



    @creationist70

    Nice! Can you post some pics of that setup of yours? And maybe some drawing of it?
    We can use some that here!

    br
    Steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 16:19:04 pm
    Ok,

    After having a look at the schematic of JNL (!) i must say that there are some differences between the schematics of Stan and JNL.
    The most important difference is that the secondairy circuit of JNL has a shared ground with the primairy circuit.
    Stan wrote vey clear that he didnt wanted a shared ground.
    How far this matters, i cannot answer  yet.

    Other difference are the resistor and the insulated innertube.
    I also see what others already mentioned before that JNL has drawn the bifcoil wires not as they should be.
    I cannot confirm that the way JNL shows his wires, that that can work. I got my step-up charging with a reversed wiring of one of the 2 coils.

    I am SURE about the fact that the only way to get real HV with low amps at yr wfc is by using an FULLY insulated innertube (maybe a fully insulated outertube, with a non insulated innertube will work as well... ;))

    I also remember an interview with a person who was doing a replication of Stan with an Insulated innertube. He said that he didnt care anymore for the gasoutput of his device. He found out that this setup was producing! losts of current! It produced more power then consumed...
    Now, that sounds interesting, is it... :) :) :)

    br
    Steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 16:27:30 pm
    hi all,
    the links at the bottom of jnaudin's site don't appear to work, has anyone got his figures for gas production against input ?

    thank you,
    br,
    james

    James, all 4 links are working fine for me. There are no figures of production in there.

    br
    Steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 16:54:27 pm
    Received some info from JN.

    "Thank you very much for your comments and for your interest in my WFC experiment published in my web site.  For the bifilar coil, I have used my old bifilar TEP coil without the ferrite rods inside, you will find the specs at :  http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/tepcoil.htm About the T1 transformer, I am using an ordinary and very common transformer (50 Hz 220/12V reversed), may be that with a toroidal ferrite transformer the result will be better.... Stay tuned on my web site, I shall soon post some news and updates... "

    Here is his BIFI coil:

    http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/tepcoil.htm
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 19:15:58 pm
    Watercellguy,

    Thanks!

    I added that info to the JNL document that i made at the beginning of this topic.
    Its here to download.

    br
    steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 21:14:41 pm
    Happy to help...

    Today I isolated a cell and started testing.... Didn't have much time but I did notice that the tubes are now ringing.... they are pretty loud. but not gas yet since I was only able to bring the voltage to about 500V.

    On a different note, my oshilloscope is rated to 400V only, can I use a volatge divider and use it at higher volatges?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 03:02:40 am
    stevie i doubt i can use anything from here besides maybe cell designs , the circuits are just too complex for alot of us

    i think i am gonna try the smacks cell cheap easy build, good production

    id love to try pwm and the laser or led thing but its just not feasible for many of us, i think the efie is pretty much needed to attain results in  mileage gains

    im fine with just goin back over to hho forums, or as hydrocars might say, the little kids table

    when you guys crack it publish it and maybe us simple folks can benefit good luck guys im sure you can do it, just avoid the spotlight and stay alive
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 05:03:55 am
    Is it possible that the cathode isolation in JN cell was leaking??

    The reason I'm saying this is because during my 1st test, my cell was generating bubbles, but only from one area, I then realized the the isolation could be leaking,

    took the cell apart and indid there was a pin hole one the isolator.


    I replaced the isolation and now no more bubbles. but the tubes are making noise, the same screaching noise as the transformer.

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 05:07:13 am
    One more thing,

    In JN diagram, he shows the Oshilloscope connected before the resistor, shouldn't the oshilloscope be connected directly to the anode and cathode?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 07:00:12 am
    h20power,

    i talked to my father today, his voltage was about 230...DC...  y he measured in dc i am not sure, but the ac value would be what, a bit over 400?? so i guess this puts it close to the vale u were seeing success with. i think we r on the same page here too!

    here is a thought , if you even get fair production of hho with a setup using insulated cathodes. and each cell leaks NO voltage, how many cells can u run before the voltage starts to b "depleted"....hmmmm?!  and how much hho will u get in the process?

    ya see, i think there is more than one way to skin a cat, and so did stan. he mixed up these ways to confuse us a little, but i think they all will work. hydrocars' way will take up a LOT less room, he is making the available gases WAY  more powerful, as opposed to making way more gas, LESS powerful! both will work, my way will have to utilize more wfc's , thats all.


    but u see when our work finally collides with his,  the perfect marriage of technology will ensue!!

    this is y i think hydrocars should forget about crayons and barney, and support all who endeavor this technology, instead of busting balls of the people he may not necessarily agree with!

    just because he may not have had luck in something, doesn't mean  someone else won't either.

    creationist70

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 09:25:23 am
    h2opower,

    did u ever try spherical electrodes. like a ball inside of a ball?? i wanted to try this. seems like it might act as a dysons sphere.

    ...and where r u getting conical shaped electrodes?

    thanx,

    creationist70
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 10:24:40 am
    It's hard too say creationist70,

    As of now I still don't have the new cone shaped wfc for testing. I know from all of my studing that this shape is the way too go, for it gives a varing point of capacitance that will keep up with waters ever changing moods. But when camster6 did his test at 480 volts he started getting the step charge, and it was not a frequency made to look like a step charge it was doing it all on it's own. I tried it and got the same results, as he did. Amp leakage is what Meyer called it, the sparking inside of the cells. With the new set up I will be able to control the water flowing through the cells and might even be able to create a cavataion bubble. The new wfc has it all everything I have learned over the years is in this wfc. From constant water level to baffel plates to keep the water from splashing around so much, and even auto fill by vacuum draw.

    Isolating the neggetive might help but when looking at Meyer's injectors the center electrod was positive and the negetive was grounded or just grounded like a spark plug. This leaves me to think that the Taylor cone my just have been what Meyer used but at very high voltage. The properties of water taking on a charge and becoming h3o+ion makes this possible, for it can only exist in water in it's droplet from and if you get it to break up lower than a droplet you will get one molecule of water and one free monoatomic hydrogen. At least this is my theory on this. Since they will have the same charge they will repel eack other and not reform into water. If the timing of the injectoin is changed to bottom dead center, it will be injecting something high preesure, into a low vaccuum area that should alone break even more water droplets up into water molecules for easy break down by the spark plug. I will start doing testing on the injectors very soon.

    Now again Meyer had four parts to his working model, the injectors, the gas processor,  the lazer help, and the steam resonator. Now a lot of the questions you ask I can't answer as of yet. but on figure 8-7 in the technical breif gives good graph data, showing that shape and shape alone does mater.  And yes there is more than one way to skin a cat for Dr. Dingel has a running model that is not like stans, and it works. Now since Stan used more than just the hydrogen  produced on demand, by putting in water in steam form and giving it a charge, and you all know the rest.  As the water mist/vapor absorbs the heat of the hydrogen/oxygen reaction it will expand  and make like a steam engine, heating up the water to push a piston down. Now that is simple gas law science PV=nRT. For me it's all coming together or at least it feels like it is. Can't wait to get the new wfc and put all these thoughts to the test. But if you ask me it seems like a lot of people are on the right track now, with many differnent ways. I just wish we all get the job done and can see the end of the age of oil in our time.

    br,
    h2opower.

    when stan used the injector he didn't even have an electrolysis cell on his car
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 26, 2008, 14:44:37 pm
     I've been looking for the practical cone shape for the cell, and , today, read about this "Taylor Cone". Did a search and found this info ??  Maybe someone smarter then me can put it to use ???

      link (http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=5121337)
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 00:38:09 am
    Well Bless your heart H20, it took a man to do what you did, and thats fix your mistake. I bow to you for this.

    Now, Make it possible h20. you have days to relax on this one sentence, And what i mean by it. Give it some thought.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 02:17:56 am

      I'm going to show my ignorance. I know NOTHING about Chemistry OR Electronics.  BUT, if you want something built from wood, metal or any other medium, draw a rough sketch, and add some general dimensions, and get out of my way.

      What I am saying, is, some are book smart, some are well trained , some pay WAY more attention, some just muddle by.

      I am VERY grateful for all this open technology being developed and shared here.  I could NEVER learn from a book or get great scores on tests. However, I have built and ran a couple of businesses, and supported my family, without working for "The Man".

      H2O, teach as well as you can, and don't get frustrated by us dummies.   ::) ::) ;D ;D  Thank You for trying.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 03:12:28 am
    New Idea for a pulse circuit. PWM into a 10Khz tuned series resonant L/C circuit to ground. Gated off for +-400usec. Take off where l1 and c1 connect. take that to one leg of a step-up xformer into a full wave bridge. This should give you the ramping pulse train. Then put your WFC across that. I tried this in a simulation and the circuit seemed to work.
    I am thinking that with this circuit this way you are creating a separate resonant circuit and you are taking the dynamic Capacitance value of the WFC out of the equation. so now you have a stable resonant circuit. Therefor no need for the PLL circuit. I don't know if this will work. I have not thought it all the way through yet.  This was with 5V out of the PWM and over 2 Kv to the cell. The step charge on the scope looked more like meyer's.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 06:02:59 am
    h2opower,

    i am mostly a gearhead, old school muscle cars. LOTS!!, of experience here. figured u like to know that back in the day, 60's 70's & early 80's holley & edlebroc made water injection kit for your car. now the turbo guys and forced induction guys use a dfferent form of this called, water meth. ...ring a bell? anyway the process is the same as what u were just talking about. the water absorbs the otherwise wasted heat and puts it to use. water expands over 1700 times it's volume when it turns to steam. nice extra help here pushing down the piston, huh??

    point well taken of ur explanation of the Japanese. y waste the heat if u can further use it, just by adding a little water!

    i use a little water injection on my cars and especially on my race engines ;) it works well!!

    just rambling,

    creationist70
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 06:35:04 am
    I agree with h20power's comments on here, nearly every one he's made in the last several months I have read....

    The secret to Stan Meyer's work (for the most part) is all outlined in his tech brief,. (Although using the physics formula's for hydrogen atom photon absorbtion I don't understand how he says visible light can excite and even ionize the hydrogen atom, It takes photon energy in the extreme Ultra-Violet to soft x ray wavelength to do that, which is nothing near the visible range)

    The funny thing I find here, on all the forums regarding Stan Meyer's and other's related work is that people are expecting to find an easy answer on the internet through forums.....There's people on every forum trying to steer you in any direction which is not the right one, and the people who know and understand things are given much critique and critism until they reach the breaking point and give up.

    For those of you who want to find out the secret to stan meyer's work and have a successful replication, you need to first step away from the computer and all the forums which provide you with an endless amount of entrapment, and .....

    GO AND DO THE RESEARCH ON YOUR OWN, First things first, go to your library and get books on a particular meyer subject:
    1. The vic coil & oscillating circuit
    2.The hydrogen fracturing process

    I recommend studing only one at a time as there's much to be learned.....

    For me I found the following books very helpful:

     Understanding Oscillators by Irving M. Gottlieb

     Read the following parts of this book!

    Page 17- Resonance in a series-tuned LC circuit

    Page 18 L/C ratio in tank circuits

    Page 30- resonant cavities

    Page 90-the electron beam in a vacuum
     
    Page 91- the magnetron

    Page 94-bunching of electrons returning to cavity grids

    Page 216- 4046 VCO PLL with 50% duty cycle and 0Hz-10KHz frequency range

    Get books on the hydrogen atom which many are available at your local library....

    And one book which is a must have (which you'll probably have to buy)

    TRANSFORMER & INDUCTOR DESIGN HANDBOOK BY Colonel Wm. T. McLyman

    This book will cost you a pretty penny but is worth it's weight in gold as it explains how to build high voltage transformers , inductors and how to build them to resonate at a certain frequency, inductance value etc...


    If you want to learn about the hydrogen fracturing process (i.e. Hydrogen Gas Gun)

    Study the following:

    -Particle accelerators

    -Vacuum tubes (like the ones used in old radio's and televisions) They have many similaraties to the hydrogen gas gun which are quite obvious when you study them.

    -Electron gun

    -Cathode ray tube

    -Gas lasers



    The secret is that there's really not much of a secret, sure some things are quite confusing for the average person which has little knowledge of electricity, physics and the like but to someone who has the knowledge it's quite easy to understand. So educate yourself as I stated above, research the topics and read the books above and you will have a much better understanding of it all, and you just might be able to build a very successful replication!!!!
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 07:23:58 am
    Thanks for the resources HMS.  I will look up those books and learn what I can.

    I think that there are a lot of us who just need to be pointed in the right direction.  With all the forums you have hundreds of different people all at different levels of knowledge and experience.  When I started researching this topic about a month and a half ago, I had no idea what a VIC was, or what any electronic part was. I went to Barn's and Noble and picked up a college level electronics book and read the first 150 pages (I have a ways to go yet) and now can at least understand the basics of electricity and how it works as well as learning all the parts of a circuit and how they work.

    Personally, I would like there to be an easy answer on a forum, it would be so easy! However, I don't expect it.  I learn what I can from more 'experienced'  people and use the resources given.  I've already priced the books you mentioned and will see if my local Library has them, if not, I will just have to buy them.

    I am waiting for parts to get shipped, so its more studying for me :)  My favorite!

    Oh yeah, I did see that waterforfuel.com had the links for JNL labs page, too.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 15:27:52 pm
    I am more than happy to provide resources.

    The truth is that every person'c cell will be different, so a firm set of instructions is hard to write up unless you start will the cell design, and even then you have the contamints in the water (Which varies from town to town) and so on which will change the charastics of the requirements..........

    That is why I will provide resources instead....I myself learned much of the things I'm sharing in the last several weeks after visiting the library and purchaseing books online....

    More about the hydrogen gas gun:

    Since we all have access to the internet, wikipedia.org is a great place to start, research the following on wikipedia and note their similaraties:

    -Cathode Ray Tube

    -Electron Gun

    -Ion Gun

    -Particle accelerator

    -Vacuum Tubes

    All use Vacuum, High voltage, etc, and a few of them even create light (Photon energy) which is in the Extreme UV to Soft X ray range, These ranges can bring the hydrogen electron out of it's Ground state (n=1) to an excited state (N=2).

    Page 10-5 (Optical Thermal Lens)  in Meyer's tech Brief talk about Vacuum and high voltage.
    Page 10-10 shows a diagram in which light energy (called Coherent energy wave output on the page) escapes the tube. If you study atom's and photon emission and absorbtion you can see here that light is emitted from the hydrogen atom because the hydrogen atom has decreased in it's energy state (increasing in energy state=Photon absorbtion) (Decreasing in energy state=photon emission)


    Also on page 10-12 of the tech brief is a simple drawing of the VIC coil, here you can see that the VIC coil is wound in a stacked pancake style. If it were not built this way there would be some serious arcing and shorting problems in the VIC coil. So, to keep the voltage's from arcing together the voltages are split up into smaller groups (In meyer's case a stacked pancake style) to the point where they no longer have enough potental to arc and cause problems.

    Also be sure to study the Lyman series and the Bohr model as well as other related hydrogen atom fromulas for excitation of the hydrogen atom as well as the emission and absorbtion of such. (Wikipedia is a good quick resource for the above information)


    there you have it...Lesson # 2
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 27, 2008, 16:10:28 pm
    H2o and HMS-776 and Z and all others,

    Is it a good idea to start a new chapter/topic on these very good teaching idea's?
    I was hoping here to continue on the JNL publications.
    Let me know what you guys think of my proposal.

    br
    Steve ;)
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 28, 2008, 03:01:24 am
    The laser is not a requirement for the system to run on a car....

    The laser just makes the process much, much more efficient.

    The laser (hydrogen gas gun) allows your 'Water mileage' to be significantly increased..As we all know it takes quite a bit of hydrogen at it's ground state (unexcited state) to run a car, a typical 4 cylinder engine would require about 80-100 liters per minute and possibly more. But if we ionize the hydrogen atom we get much more energy and more heat. To combat this we use exhaust gas recirculation which includes non combustable gasses and water mist when metered correctly has the ability to make the hydrogen gas burn exactly as gasoline would. Meyer was a smart man, wasen't he?


    H2Opower, I guess I'll have to look into this Victor guy you speak of....


    Steevie-Sure......But don't expect me around here long....I will go when my time comes............................................ ..............

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 28, 2008, 10:48:47 am
    @H2O

    I know that JL is working on an improved setup and that he will publishe his results.
    Coming week, i will have my own replication of his work  and hope to have a startingpoint for developing this technology.
    For me, it will be the first time of seeing hydrogen with an insulated innertube. Electrolysis is an chemical proces.
    As far as i can see,  is that JL  / Stan Meyer proces a not chemical one. I have always wanted to see that proces in action.
    Why?
    Simple. It seems to be Over Unity. Not  a little bit, but  very much OU.
    Ok, i know. First we need numbers. And to get numbers, we first have to make a working setup.

    @HMS
    I agree on yr theory about the amount of hydrogen we need, when the gas is in its lower energy state.
    We have here a topic on that.
    http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,407.0.html
    I have still on my lab a LEDS device for energizing the gas with specific frequencys.
    Its not finished, yet. First i ll go for the JL replication. Then i will continue on that part.

    br
    Steve


    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 29, 2008, 10:00:19 am
    Hi all,
    Say Steve I found this book or what ever it is, but I haven't desided on buying it or not, but it is on the technology we are working on. http://www.jstor.org/pss/2415876

    I was doing more reseach on the Taylor cones and found this "Disintegration of Water Drops in an Electric Field." Now to get water to disintergrate does that not turn it into hydrogen and oxygen ??? I think I might get this to further my studies on all of this. What do you think?

    br,
    h2opower.

    Hi H2O,

    Nice book!
    It looks like that book fits your study well.
    " The photographs give an indication of how the axial jets are produced but no complete analytical description of the process is attempted "
    The book seems to leave enough room for you to do research.......
    Could be worth while to buy it.
    Any idea what it costs?

    br
    Steve


    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 29, 2008, 11:09:41 am
    I don't know a lot about about coils, I was wondering could a stun gun coil be used ,  a new just came out that can hit 2 million volts. Any ideas?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 29, 2008, 16:36:46 pm
    As far as I can tell you really don't get much action until you get around 480 volts too the wfc, and Dr. Dingel says 20k-30k volts in his work.

    You seems to have a lot of info about Dingel's. Can you share a link where he states that he is using 20kV-30kV? Dingel uses honeycomb configuration. I find this interesting because I find it technically complicated when electrodes are close to one another especially when they are in water, be it insulated or not. 
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on June 30, 2008, 17:42:31 pm
    As far as I can tell you really don't get much action until you get around 480 volts too the wfc, and Dr. Dingel says 20k-30k volts in his work.

    You seems to have a lot of info about Dingel's. Can you share a link where he states that he is using 20kV-30kV? Dingel uses honeycomb configuration. I find this interesting because I find it technically complicated when electrodes are close to one another especially when they are in water, be it insulated or not. 

    I got this information from watching his videos and the circuit that he is using. In one of his videos you can read on the hho device 20k volts and on the circuit I have for him its 30k volts. So I say 20k-30k volts, to cover the differance, most of what I have to do with Dr. Dingel's work is guessing, but I am pretty good at it. Having the circuit diagram really helped me to see the simularities between his work, Meyer's work, and Puharich's work, all are from Nikola Tesla.  I did have all that I think I know on Dr. Dingel posted but I saw fit to take it all down, personal reasons.

    h2opower.

    I am not able to find any video where he claims that or wrote that figure on his device. The circuit that you posted was drawn by someone else (it was with German text if I am not mistaken). So you are guessing 20kV-30kV but not from what Dingel himself has claimed.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 01, 2008, 02:44:11 am
    Okay, thanks. I asked to avoid confusion. Readers may imply otherwise if you don't state clearly.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 03, 2008, 10:31:02 am
    On the issue of straight tubes, parabola and other configs, are there any results from parallel plates that look promising?

    Thanks,

    Turtle
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 17, 2008, 07:43:40 am
    i have been searching for a while would anyone know where to get a toroidal transformer which meets jnaudin's requirements?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 17, 2008, 11:25:22 am
    i have been searching for a while would anyone know where to get a toroidal transformer which meets jnaudin's requirements?
    I think you go search for a small PCB transformer. The bigger the lower the max frequency is...
    I will have a try soon with a little trafo.

    br
    steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 26, 2008, 20:09:13 pm
    I think by far this guy is the closest to getting it right....BUt he's only 18.8Kv's away from water ionization by voltage....Water ionization will work at low voltages, but at higher voltage it is much better....It works much like a car's ignition system...20Kv+ is where things really start to happen!

    The spark plug is part of an LC circuit which  operates at high voltages....At high voltage, the air is ionized between the anode and cathode of the spark plug allowing electron leakage to take place between the two which is seen as the spark.

    The water capacitor is very similar to a spark plug, except that electron leakage is not allowd...The spark plug also shows us a very good electrical insulator to use (ceramic) which protects at high voltages....

     Everyone here needs to look up the following patent -4,427,512 "Water decomposition method and device using ionization by collision."
    In this patent the water ionization process is described using a ceramic insulation between the anode and cathode much like that of a spark plug!

    IF YOU WANT GOOD RESULTS, YOU NEED HIGH VOLTAGE AND A GOOD INSULALTING MATERIAL!!!
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 26, 2008, 22:28:20 pm
    I think by far this guy is the closest to getting it right....BUt he's only 18.8Kv's away from water ionization by voltage....Water ionization will work at low voltages, but at higher voltage it is much better....It works much like a car's ignition system...20Kv+ is where things really start to happen!

    The spark plug is part of an LC circuit which  operates at high voltages....At high voltage, the air is ionized between the anode and cathode of the spark plug allowing electron leakage to take place between the two which is seen as the spark.

    The water capacitor is very similar to a spark plug, except that electron leakage is not allowd...The spark plug also shows us a very good electrical insulator to use (ceramic) which protects at high voltages....

     Everyone here needs to look up the following patent -4,427,512 "Water decomposition method and device using ionization by collision."
    In this patent the water ionization process is described using a ceramic insulation between the anode and cathode much like that of a spark plug!

    IF YOU WANT GOOD RESULTS, YOU NEED HIGH VOLTAGE AND A GOOD INSULALTING MATERIAL!!!

    Hi HMS,

    Thats a nice theory, but can you tell us more in practice what to do with that?
    I have for example a nice tube setup with 1 fully insulated innertube.
    I can tell you one thing. I never seen 1 buble coming of that  tube and i tried many circuits to drive it!
    If you can, please tell us how to do it.

    br
    steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 26, 2008, 23:27:59 pm
    To put it in the simplest way: You build it as shown in the tech brief...

    It's funny that people are building chokes (inductors) and not paying any attention to how there being built...People say 100 turns of this or that...What about the inductance values, and the capacitance values of the water capacitor which form the LC circuit...If you research LC circuits the reasonant frequency is such that it depends on both the inductance of the inductor, and the capacitance of the cap. The reasons for resonance is to help electrons flow at a higher pressure "higher voltage" and at the same time to reduce current.

    This being said all parts of the circuit must be made to operate at the same frequency.....If you build your LC circuit to operate at a certain frequency, but your transformer was not built to operate at that frequency you will experience losses, if you build a pulsing circuit which cannot meet the frequency of the LC circuit you'll never get anywhere.....It all boils down to math, impedance matching, inductance coupling in the transformer, a well built water cap, etc etc....

    I don't think Stan spent 13 years just experimenting with different designs and a different number of turns on his coils, he did the math, he worked his butt off and he eventutally made it  happen....You can't just throw something together and expect big results. You've got to educate yourself on every possible and related aspect of stan's work......Most of his work allready exists in some form of another and we use it daily....For examp[le I described earlier the automobiles ignition system which consists of a High voltage transformer and forms an LC circuit....The spark plug is nearly a mirror image of the water capacitor stan meyer designed.....Many high voltage caps use ceramic insulators the same way spark plugs use.....

    TO BUILD IT

    FOLLOW STAN MEYER'S TECH BRIEF.....A 3" tube with a .750 ID and a .50 OD rod wil resonate at around 5KhZ, from here we know the type of pulsing ciruit we will need to build.....

    Build the Water cap, Get it coated with a ceramic insulating material with a high dielectric
    Dip it in water and measure the Capacitance value
    Now you can do the math and dtermine the inductance of your chokes required to get the circuit to resonate at 5KhZ...
    From there you have the VIC coil, which contains a lot of math to figure it out....But go from there, stop wasting time experimenting, build ecerything to the specs, if stan doesen't give you the specs, search for them, after all he's not the first one to design a RF transformer, and LC circuit, and a pulsing circuit.....Good Luck!
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 00:15:48 am

     This explanation sounds just like what Bob Boyce may have done. I heard his system is VERY meticulous to build.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 01:18:44 am
    Dear Steve,

    It is the water  capacitor and not so much the circuit. I have been able to get a reaction using a one inch inner tube insulated on the outside with a PVC pipe. My outer tube ID is 1.375 ".

    PVC has a dielectric constant of 4.4 much like delrin. I am using a MOT and have gotten bubbles with an ignition coil.

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 09:17:58 am
    Dear Steve,

    It is the water  capacitor and not so much the circuit. I have been able to get a reaction using a one inch inner tube insulated on the outside with a PVC pipe. My outer tube ID is 1.375 ".

    PVC has a dielectric constant of 4.4 much like delrin. I am using a MOT and have gotten bubbles with an ignition coil.


    hi, as i already thought, you also do not have a fully insulated innertube. Yr inside and top/bottum edges are blanc metal.
    I did that once and got bubbles too.
    Not sure if thats the way.
    You should get some kind of capacitance, i ll gues..maybe its time to re do that setup and do some capacitance measurements.
    I know that Andrea Puharich also had a small kathode edge and a larger anode.
    If thats the trick to get hv acros the system...

    can you do that too? How much nF is yr little cell?
    Maybe we can go from there...

    for sure, i know resonance circuit pretty well..
    Just need to find the right capa from the cell.

    br
    steve

    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 09:20:18 am
    Ps.

    yaro, how much volts did you get across your tube with the MOT? Would like to known that very much!

    br

    steve
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 19:00:49 pm
    I am measuring a peak of 210 volts dc. I measure 3.3 nF as the cell capacitor. I do not have an O'scope so the measurements may not be true.

    Yes the tube is not completely insulated but I was getting a dead short with zero bubbles without the insulation.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 21:22:17 pm
    i notice in some of the close up shots of stanley meyers tube setup you can see the metal exposed at the top....so even so his tubes weren't completely insulated....unless there is some sort of clear coat insulation.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 27, 2008, 23:46:15 pm
    Hi all,

    its very difficult to keep stans many setups seperated in our research. Many of us, only seen the alternator and tubes in stans vid.
    We know that that one was NOT his hv setup.

    maybe we should categorize stans setups in this forum...

    br
    steve





    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on July 28, 2008, 00:24:48 am

       
    Quote
    maybe we should categorize stans setups in this forum..

      I believe that is an excellent idea, Stevie.

      There is info spread all over ALL the Forums. Makes it hard for us less educated types, to keep a train of thought going ???
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on August 03, 2009, 15:57:35 pm
    Get it coated with a ceramic insulating material with a high dielectric
    Does anyone have a good hint which thin insulating material i could use on my inner tube?
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on August 03, 2009, 21:47:13 pm
    Start with saran wrap - cheap and thin.
    Title: Re: Stan Meyer cracked by JNaudin!!!!
    Post by: Login to see usernames on August 05, 2009, 14:30:27 pm
    Seems that Mr. Meyer was using the OXYGEN to run his car, not solely the Hydrogen ??

      A post by oneminde supposedly explains it on energetic forum.  ::)