Ionizationx: a clean environment is a human right!

Projects by members => Projects by members => Steve => Topic started by: Steve on February 25, 2017, 15:17:28 pm

Title: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 15:17:28 pm
Hi all,

It seems evident that the radiolysis proces is done with emf waves in the soft x ray band.
To get even started, i have to find a way to measure soft x rays and also a way to produce them.
It all must be done with some kind of safety measures, not to get over doses of other not healthy type of radiations.

Here a pdf i posted once. Its about on how to create soft x rays with ambient air and a sparkplug.
Its the best match i found sofar.

Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 16:43:35 pm
bro lets construct a xray tube

you need some lead plates to shield it....

i would build a copper box and solder 5 sides and leave one open for service inside... than i would add means to apply vaccum to it with a valve on one side...outside the box the lead foils will help hold the xray inside... at the top i would add a glass to be the output of the xrays
.. inside you need two connectors for the filament, for that we can use whatever heater filament, or even better if we could use a solid piece of iron and coat it with some barium oxides... than you need a high current connector to light it up red hot

for the target i would use tungsten piece... it must be big enough to allow for the dissipation....and it can be connected to the outside wall phiscally so it cool down with the copper walls

for fixing the glass into the copper you can use car grade silicon those used for sealing without paper

for the heat part it must be isolated with ceramics that can handle it..

i just thought of something

if we could have a double x ray tube we could use the heat generated at the target to emit electrons for a second target and so on.. such that the emission is what cools down the target... the main idea is to have two tungsten targets with heating elements inside.. and maybe a temperature sensor to limit the current for them ..

for that we need a high voltage transformer having one winding at its start and another on the end of the winding to serve as filament heating and a secondary therebetween to give high voltage to them....

the frequency can be controled and in this way the xray will be generated with twice the frequency...

if the target is to be used as electron source than would be important to keep the heat at it so inside the copper box there should be thermic insulation too

as you can see this would be the most efficient xray generation possible.. as it dont waste the heat that was not capable to be converted into xray for the next cycle...


Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 16:56:43 pm
i just found this: http://www.euvlitho.com/2016/S26.pdf
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 18:56:51 pm
Hi Fabio,

I am happy that you jump so enthousiastic in this  :)
I had the same type of ideas, but making it from scratch is a project on its own. Which is good of course, but will consume lots of time.
I was more thinking like buying one of these tubes
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-6BK4C-6EL4A-SYLVANIA-Tube-/120985708289
And then followe the instructables website instructions
http://www.instructables.com/id/Home-built-X-ray-Source/

You know, i can easy make a quartz tube thru the middle of the cell and lower in the quartztube one of these x ray tubes doing soft rays.
I think that Herman was experimenting with those 30 versions of his system to make a cheap version of this type of techno.


Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 20:08:23 pm
Another piece of brain food:

High voltage magnetrons emit a significant intensity of X-rays not only from the cathode sidearm but also from the output waveguide. These rays can constitute a health hazard unless adequate shielding for X-ray radiation is provided. This is a characteristic of all magnetrons and the X-rays emitted correspond to a voltage much higher than that of the anode.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2017, 20:13:00 pm
http://www.dangerouslaboratories.org/xray1.html

DIY x ray project... ???
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 26, 2017, 03:27:57 am
An easy single shot way to check for X-rays is to place an un-opened roll of photographic film near the apparatus.  When developed, black frames indicate no X-rays, while clear frames indicate their presence.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 26, 2017, 09:07:24 am
An easy single shot way to check for X-rays is to place an un-opened roll of photographic film near the apparatus.  When developed, black frames indicate no X-rays, while clear frames indicate their presence.

Thank you. That is a helpfull tip !
I have a simple geiger counter here but no idea if it detects x rays....
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 26, 2017, 09:12:50 am
https://www.mirion.com/introduction-to-radiation-safety/types-of-ionizing-radiation/

Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 26, 2017, 17:25:18 pm
steve the xray detection principle may be the same as the geiger counter but maybe the range is not favorable...

a tube having a noble gas will ionize under xray making the gas conductive... measuring the change in resistance would be a way to detect the xrays but mainly this detectors works with stages to be more sensitive... called multipliers

another way to do it is with photoelectric measurements, you also need a tube that has a filament covered with a low workfunction material so apply a voltage to the plate and measure the current when xray come there should be a current
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 01, 2017, 19:19:22 pm
X-ray production whenever electrons of high energy strike a heavy metal target, like tungsten or copper. When electrons hit this material, some of the electrons will approach the nucleus of the metal atoms where they are deflected because of there opposite charges (electrons are negative and the nucleus is positive, so the electrons are attracted to the nucleus). This deflection causes the energy of the electron to decrease, and this decrease in energy then results in forming an x-ray.

Another one:
You can also get some X-ray production via field emission, whereby electrons escape a cold metal due to very high local electric fields (the Schottky effect).
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 02, 2017, 05:21:28 am
I  got a course at the university about chemistry of radiation i learned about ionizing radiation of many types and xray was part of it, from what i remember the electrons get into the metal electrosphere and knock out an electron at a inner orbit so the atom is not it is not stable so an electron from an upper orbit must go down to the inner orbit thereto it will  emit the xray , its energy will depend on the orbital reached..

another way to generate xrays is to use particle accelerators and an arrange of magnetic fields to make the particle oscillate and emit radiation.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 02, 2017, 09:47:29 am
action=share

Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 13:19:22 pm
Dear all, here some valuable information.
I measured with my geiger counter a radiation coming of the HV unit with sparkgap. The gap radiates.
The bigger the gap the longer distance the radiation reaches.

1mm gap = 3.5cm distance
1cm gap = 11 cm distance
2cm gap = 19 cm distance
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 14:24:45 pm



Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 15:42:38 pm
this is strange... because it should not generate xray on such small gap... the collisions with air molecules would not allow the electrons to impact with enough energy at the target...

is your geiger counter based on a ionization tube? or is a electronic sensor?

the mean free path at ambient pressure is too small to electrons to gain enough energy...

i´m afraid you are picking up electromagnetic noise at your counter... or i could be totally wrong

i see all the electronics of your counter exposed... thats why i´m thinking about this...

my pll circuit when not shield properly also picks strange behavior...

Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 16:29:21 pm
http://mightyohm.com/blog/products/geiger-counter/

It uses the sbm 20 tube which is ionisation based principle...
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 16:47:00 pm
i can wrap the counter in alu.....

Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2017, 18:19:35 pm
interesting!

i believe to get proper reading you must get a good shielding of the electronic parts leaving only the tube exposed...

i would even kind of shield the tube to avoid ultraviolet from ionizing it so you can know its xrays for sure

i think aluminum foil is not enough i would go for an aluminum box... only the tube outside of it

what you think about?

another thing you could verify is if electromagnetics makes it blink like getting the counter close to a transformer being pulsed and collapsing strongly to see if is not receiving interference...

a sparkgap can transmit like an antena..
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 04, 2017, 10:57:51 am
11 milliamps discharge.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 04, 2017, 21:04:08 pm
It has been reported that intense EUV emission was observed at low temperatures (e.g.  ) from atomic hydrogen and certain atomized elements or certain gaseous ions which ionize at integer multiples of the potential energy of atomic hydrogen, 
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 04, 2017, 21:06:44 pm
Typically the emission of extreme ultraviolet light from hydrogen gas is achieved via a discharge at high voltage, a high power inductively coupled plasma, or a plasma created and heated to extreme temperatures by RF coupling (e.g. >106 K) with confinement provided by a toroidal magnetic field. We report the observation of intense extreme ultraviolet (EUV) emission at low temperatures (e.g. <103 K) from atomic hydrogen and certain atomized pure elements or certain gaseous ions which ionize at integer multiples of the potential energy of atomic hydrogen.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 04, 2017, 21:26:57 pm
It is known that sufficient amount of Extreme Ultraviolet (EUV) radiation from the star can drive hydrodynamic outflow of hydrogen that may drag heavier species from the atmosphere of the planet.
Title: Re: soft x-ray generation and measurements
Post by: Login to see usernames on October 11, 2017, 11:27:13 am
Radiation Portal Monitor Portal monitors for continuous measurement of radiation level at vehicle, train or pedestrian border checkpoints, entry control points of nuclear power plants or other objects of national importance and quick detection of authorized and unauthorized export and import of neutron and gamma radiation sources.
https://ecotestgroup.com/products/radiation-portal-monitor/ (https://ecotestgroup.com/products/radiation-portal-monitor/)