Ionizationx: a clean environment is a human right!

Electrolysis => Electrolysis => Our Alternator => Topic started by: hydro on January 11, 2008, 23:08:31 pm

Title: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on January 11, 2008, 23:08:31 pm
This is our schematic!

BETA VERSION


(http://ionizationx.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=97.0;attach=193)
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 04, 2008, 14:30:42 pm
i got my fets and igbt's today, my schematic will be going together really soon!!!

i built this circuit several times already, each time the fets couldn't handle the small one amp, this is because fets these days are sorry, so i had to go out and get a real fet.

THIS IS THE FETS YOU SHOULD USE, Any FET 400 VOLTS or OVER, And With 30 amps or OVER.

I very Strongly So Highly Recommend using the FQA30N40 Fet, its around 8 dollars shipping not included, A few of you guy's could get together and order them? i myself is not interested, i have better fets now. i can include the part numbers to my new improved fets later.  it could take 2 days to 3 weeks before my fets arrive, just be patient! between the new circuit and the circuit i had already posted, there want be much of a change. the 50k pot has to go though..

Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 11, 2008, 04:47:34 am
just about any fet over 400 volts over 30 amps will do!
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 13, 2008, 06:20:03 am
i have now 2 diff types of fets that i have not tested, but i think they will be very good. here is the 2 part numbers.

Power Mosfet 45N50 500v 45A 0.12 ohm, 625W "FDH45N50F"

IGBT Fast Switching HGTG20N60 600V 70A 1.6Vsat "20N60A4 ?? NG47AH ??"


i got my fets a few days ago, i have been trying to learn how to make a PCB, NO i dont want one made for me! i intend on making boards so that when i need one i dont have to rely on others.

i have used XeroX High Gloss Laser paper and it works well, i take my picture on cd to my local city store to get them to print it out for me. I have not made or etched a pcb yet, i am still waiting for stevie to get home before i start this process of making this board, i hope it goes easy because i am getting somewhat flusterated with the tackyness radioshack pcb's.

i look forward to post this circuit as soon as i can.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 19, 2008, 06:06:23 am
ok guy's, this is the second board that i've etched, the first board was junk with many mistakes. this board is ok and will work, but its not all that pretty. anyhow this board was pulled from the junk pile and used, i will go ahead and assemble this board until my new single sided boards arrive. when i first etched a baord it took me 5 hours, i didn't know what i was doing, also i had to reuse the etcing fluid on this board so it took about 2 hours to etch, its gotta be done neater and faster next time.



Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 19, 2008, 09:00:40 am
and now its completed...
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 19, 2008, 09:24:45 am
Nice, looking cool, dude!

br
steve
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 19, 2008, 22:48:51 pm
looks good Hyro. That is a monster transistor  8)
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 20, 2008, 05:47:51 am
Ok guy's, this is one reason the circuit is a beta circuit,,, i can say to whoever is trying to replicate this i feel very bad for you as you must have whent or are going threw a bunch of crap with this circuit....

i have been working on trying to get the alternator up and going for the past 2 to 3 hours, i am flusterated sad and ill,,,, either there is a wrong component on the board somewhere or the timer is flawed, or the fets just is junk, this is one reason i have not made a final circuit, but i'm making one now and it may take a month? i have to wait on parts and stuff threw mail so thats what takes so long.

i think that all fets are junk, i have never had this many problems before, i did manage to get it to work but the fet got hot after that each time i hooked up a fet they all kept going bad just one right after the other, i think the fets are junk!

i will go over my board to make sure there is no flaws in it, i have checked the circuit with an oscilloscope and it seems to be working find, however the drain of ALL the fets do not show anything.

the FQ chip is like 8 to 9 dollors plus shipping, enough of these garbadge fets, im ording it if it cost 20 dollars, ITS WORTH IT not to have to deal with this!!!!!!!!

SO, who has successfully replicated this??? If you did, and you got harmonics, what FET did you use? i had no problems with the FQ fet till i bumped the wrong capacitor and smoked it, man i gotta have that fet back

as you can see this circuit is not easy, i have many many hours in on it, when i get the circuit together and confirm  its worthy of being released i will release it..
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 20, 2008, 06:41:20 am
GOod lord, i cant find the fets,, i found a place but to ship its 25 bucks, man thats a rip off, i may not can afford this
FQA30N40
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 21, 2008, 17:52:10 pm
i got it working with the fets that i had, the problem was you cant ground gate the fet, how odd, i also made new discovery's along the way. i would like to make a video for all of you, but im not going to make a crap video so it will just have to wait till everythings perfect, given the fact that all i have to work with right now is crap parts it may be a while, also the 6 tubes that i have added will call for a bigger drivermotor, the motor i have will probably hit harmonics pretty good, not %100 sure right now.

Each fet works differently, the circuit has to be designed around the fet, so when i make a public schematic it will contain a 3 way switch for selecting diff types of fets that operate on a min gate voltage of 5 volts 250 ua.

some fets dont like to be turned off, they turn there selfs off. some fets such as the FQA30N40 will not turn off, you have to litterly turn them off.  other fets that doesn't like to be turned off may require no resistor between the timer and gate. you gotta know your fets, i did not build my circuit around the fet, you should see it my circuit now, it looks like a troubleshooting board, many tracks was destroyed, its junk now.

im just glad all you guy's don't have to go threw what i'm going threw, one day soon i will lay a working circuit on the table that will work for everyone. 
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 21, 2008, 19:11:58 pm
Hi,

glaid you found the bug,made.
Yesterday i just blew another circuit to haven...
It makes me sad......

br
steve
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 21, 2008, 20:17:30 pm
nice to hear you fixed the problem hydro. I hate faultfinding :'(
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 25, 2008, 12:41:08 pm
just to make sure no one has a misunderstanding, heres what i meant.

The alternator can self ignite itself at high rpm's. The cell also holds a charge, this charge is greater than what 2 AA batterys in series can offer a coil.

so if you pulse a coil with 2 AA batteries you dont hardly get much, if you do it with a cell, there is something in the cell that opens a can of worms on any coil, try it.



Before the alternator can self ignite, it has to be spinning. during freespin nothing connected, the stator outputs a very small voltage, im not sure it will even show up on the voltage meter.

now you take the rotor leads, you connect both of them to the stator and you hold them, nothing will happen. you keep holding them. the stator will appear to start resonating with the rotor. there will come a point to where you will have to start regulating, if you fail to regulate you will blow your diodes. The stator only works connected to the rotor in one direction.

now that you got that out of the way, you hook the cell to the stator, remember the cell holds a charge, so you connect it to the stator with the same polarity, this also helps the alternator to self ignite faster.

when you get the alternator self ignited, the power comming from the stator going into the rotor has to be regulated, if not you will be going at full blast and this will blow your diodes, not to mention your driver motor couldn't handle the torq.


to regulate you put a fet between the rotor and stator, you regulate voltage and amperage coming from the stator going into the rotor. The way the regulation works is the fet becomes a resistor that pulses. fets dont like to be a resistor, the want to be all the way on, or all the way off. when you run them inbetween they get hot and smoke.

the FQA30N40 is a good fet to be used as a pulsing resistor, if it did not resist current you could not regulate.

the problems i had with the new fets in the above post is they did not resist properly, they would not self ignite the alternator properly, when these fets reached a point to where it would self ignite the alternator, they self ignited it at full blast now allowing you to regulate down. when you tried to regulate down it would cut off.

to solve this problem with those types of resistors that has funny resistance when in use, i had to add resistance to them, i did this by placing a coil between the fet and rotor, this gave it more resistance, i could then regulate smoothly, by this time i had already ruined all my fets for past trouble shooting.

also the pulsing fet, known to me as a pulsing resistor causes a sort of harmonics to the fuel cell. the reason for the fet is you have to vary the amplitude of the voltages going into the cell, this amplitude is related to the rpm's at which the alternator is spinning at. when you regulate this way you get harmonics.

other problems i came across is much like the dave lawton circuit. you have a 220 ohm resistor comming from the gate of the timer going to the gate of the fet, and you have a 820 ohm resistor comming from ground going to the gate of the fet. the 820 ohm resistor shuts the fet off. however the fets i had refused to work with the 820 ohm resistor in place. the other fet refused to work with any resistor in place.

in most fets datasheets it will tell you that the fet gate should be around 5 volts 250ua, the timer is plenty good enough for the fet without having to use external drivers to gate the fet.

you dont want the fet to be all the way off, the fet is not just there to allow pulses to go threw, the fets job and main function is to become a pulsing resistor. the FQA30N40 used both resistors.

so it is problematic for me to bring you guy's a schematic because the schematic has to be build around the fet you're using. however i did get the new fet to work, it still got hot, its a very poor fet to use.

maybe stevie will post the fet he is using, im not sure how his fet holds up under attack. But atleast you see what you need, the fet does not send pulses to the alternator, it gets voltages from the alternator, and it lets it LOOP around acting as a switching and pulsing resistor. i will throw together a very simple circuit soon
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on February 29, 2008, 06:36:05 am
fets are in, test is done,,, the FQ's kick ass, just a few touch ups,, a couple of days and the schematic will be good for release...
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on March 03, 2008, 03:45:35 am
well, i hit harmonics with my 6 cells, my current driver motor is to small to hit harmonics, so i have to get a bigger one.

no i havent got production numbers yet. stevie may have??

when i get this cell going i will compare the production against normal electrolysis and post the results.

i can leave by saying with a battery it may take me 5 mins to gain 5 psi, and with the alternator it takes just over a min, and that is monkeying around, also thats with 12 volts to the sell as well. so that should give you some sorta ideal for now.


also, i have been reading alot on stanleys work, and i can see that what i'm using is very similar to what stanley was using. there is more to come! alot more. i look forward to posting this circuit!
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 03, 2008, 14:03:33 pm
Hi Hydro!

Any progress on this experiment?

Regards

Wouter
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 03, 2008, 23:44:52 pm
yes, this is the setup that gets me 500 cc's a min, 8.3 cc's a second with no cap added. i run this circuit will 12 cells, i think i should retry the self LOOP method and see if i get more gas.

i will measure my output for my 12 cells with an battery to, then i will post in the proper place.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 04, 2008, 15:07:41 pm
Hydro

Taking into consideration that you are NOT using any checmicals, 0.5 lpm is excellent!!
Please keep us updated on your measurements, including the power consumed. Thanks!

Wouter
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 04, 2008, 22:28:37 pm
http://ionizationx.com/index.php?topic=298.0
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 04, 2008, 23:54:49 pm
yes, this is the setup that gets me 500 cc's a min, 8.3 cc's a second with no cap added. i run this circuit will 12 cells, i think i should retry the self LOOP method and see if i get more gas.

i will measure my output for my 12 cells with an battery to, then i will post in the proper place.

What frequency are you pulsing the rotor at? Are you gating it or straight square pulse?

I dont know why you pu the capacitor in the first  place as it confused everyone including me.

First of all with a capacitor you smooth any pulsed input. Thats what capcitors do, the smooth the input and thats why you add them to smooth the alternator output or bridge diode output etc.

To then have a schematic with a capacitor and a pulsed input to the capacitor is a redundancy some one with a basic working knowledge of circuits could have pointed out a long time ago. hmmmm surprised no one bought this up before but I guess you dont have too many grandpa simpsons on this forum.
 
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 05, 2008, 01:46:04 am
The capacitor acts as a Blocker, Resistor, and capacitor, the capacitor makes it possible for the fet to go into LOOP MODE more smoothly < Without the capacitor i also did not get Square waves with 3 phase Full Bridge rectified harmonics on top of the square wave. The capacitor also make ease of regulation!

With my 6 cell setup, i could not gain harmonics without the capacitor, i also could not regulate smoothly,,  The capacitor also helps to Prevent Back EMF Spikes from damaging the FET.

This schematic was not put on paper then tried, it was found by accident.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 05, 2008, 18:13:00 pm
waterfalcon, its been a ruff weak for me, sorry if my post was in the negative, carry on! and welcome to the forum!
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 08, 2008, 00:55:13 am
Hydrocars Help!

I finally got a alternator motor setup with an 8 inch pulley on the motor and a 2 inch pulley on the alternator.

My motor is 1/3HP motor 115 volt motor

http://cgi.ebay.com/1-3HP-115-Volt-AC-Motor_W0QQitemZ170122260563QQihZ007QQcategoryZ71400QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

But the alternator will not turn. At my age this has been quite a struggle.

I need to know is my motor too weak?

What is the minimum size motor i need...remember i will be pulsing the rotor coils too and my motor wont even turn the rotor with zero load.

do i need a larger motor and how much HP do I need?
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 08, 2008, 01:14:10 am
It sounds like your alternator may have a problem. Can you turn it by hand? It should rotate easily. 1/3 HP should turn the alternator with no load but you should get 1 hp or more.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 08, 2008, 03:56:51 am
Hydrocars Help!

I finally got a alternator motor setup with an 8 inch pulley on the motor and a 2 inch pulley on the alternator.

My motor is 1/3HP motor 115 volt motor

http://cgi.ebay.com/1-3HP-115-Volt-AC-Motor_W0QQitemZ170122260563QQihZ007QQcategoryZ71400QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

But the alternator will not turn. At my age this has been quite a struggle.

I need to know is my motor too weak?

What is the minimum size motor i need...remember i will be pulsing the rotor coils too and my motor wont even turn the rotor with zero load.

do i need a larger motor and how much HP do I need?

i am very sorry  i did not see your post sooner waterfalcon, you should be able to spin the alternator with your hand very easily. i used a 3/4 hp with my 6 cells and it worked great but i dont recommend it now. today i use a 3 HP motor with my cells.

i'm truely sorry for this late reply, if you need any more help just ask.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 10, 2008, 00:58:11 am
Thanks everybody and hydrocars, I am now sure its my motor. I have a tractor alternator 28 volts 55 amps boshc, i can turn it freely but the motor wont pull.  At least not with an 8 inch pulley.

So I am getting a 3Hp motor like you recommend hydrocars, so it can drive the tractor alternator at full load on the rotor. Will get back once i set up the new motor with pulley and all.

But now i dont want to waste this setup that i already have...so can any one give me links to small light alternators that i can use to run with my 1/3HP motor.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 10, 2008, 03:28:45 am
oh man, you said 1/3, thats a small motor. i really cant see much you can do with that less HP. Alternators Can be monster machines depending on how you use them.. now if you want to take that small motor and spin an alternator it would be good to charge batteries with, IF the battery just needs a small charge, but if the battery needs to much charging it will pull that small motor down to much.

this is just what i think, i'm not even really sure that motor would even turn and alternator under any load.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on May 14, 2008, 15:32:59 pm
Hi all  my first post I like this altenator circuit   I'd like to add another altenator to my nissan pathfinder there's a place to mount another belt driven device on my motor ( I ASSUME IT'S FOR THE AC THAT I DON'T HAVE ) ..I think that anadditional altenator is the only way to get enough production without taxing my present altenator . any thoughts  is it feasible .
Bob 
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 02, 2008, 21:56:44 pm
anyone in the western NY area?

I'm pretty handy with just about everything EXCEPT reading schematics and building circuit boards.

I'll drive over, bring some beer, and watch you build it. then pay you for your services. Hopefully retaining enough to build another or make adjustments.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 03, 2008, 04:29:53 am
I am running a 1/3 HP motor also. Yes its too small but it does work. I can get just around 1 amp 5 volts across the rotor but not set like the aternator schematic provided, and after that it pulls the motor down. However it seems the size of the motor must be larger than the amperage you want on your power hungry cell. My alternator is a Delco 10Si 63-70 amp. 1/3 HP is approx 250watts  /by 12 volts and get 20amps (240watts) across the cell. Maybe I havn't read somewhere but what is the size of the capacitor used accross the rotor provided in the schematic? Better yet what size cap is needed depending on the particular cell circuit load, does it matter? As I'm sure that cap size depends on your cell size maybe. My cell is 21 tubes in 7 triplets 12" long 1", 1 1/4", 1 1/2". Lots of gas and want more.
Title: Re: Ionizationx Alternator Schematic
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 25, 2008, 04:51:17 am
Maybe I should modify the above post a little. Running a alternator off a motor.
Lets use my alternator fogures of 63-70a possible off the alternator.
If 1/3hp of usable power = approx 250watts
If 1/2hp = approx 375watts
If 1hp = approx 750watts(746).
Motors efficencies are generally low 60 to 65% at the rated output.
To get the 1hp usable 750watts takes just over 1100watts of power to make in a motor.
In a 12vdc circuit from a converter or inverter it will take approx 100amps or close of 12vdc.
Also you should not run your equiptment at 100% so it needs to be larger. (keep the heating down).
In order to do this the automobile should be equipted with 150a alternator to start, with at least a spare high amperage battery for cell circuitry (start-up)
The larger alternator on your automobile will acomadate the redi-line and charging the battery's as well as automobile loads and usage.
Your 120vac converter or inverter should be approx 1250-1500watts
Is there any other 120v additive to the circuit?
Since the alternator with the setup above is 60+ amps possible, maybe the cell will be 20-40-60a dependent on size.
The motor will not draw its full current if it is not working its full output.
That converter or inverter will still be able to drive another transformer for some other part of the system.
The spare battery can also be used for more electronics.
It seems a 1500watt redi-line would be appropriate.
What do you think?