Author Topic: Water fuel cell =  (Read 7222 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 612
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2016, 22:28:43 pm »
What is the purpose of the EEC?

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3634
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2016, 23:02:06 pm »
i was considering if it would not be possible to amplify the energy by using part of the gas output as source of electrons but creating such a system where this electrons are forced to discharge in a potential diference greater than the 1.23v lets say it could be 123v... the energy output would be 100x greater.. so if we feedback this the system can become selfsustained oscilation somehow..

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3634
Re: Water fuel cell capacitor
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2016, 00:33:06 am »
as in the case of aluminum and copper that i showed to you the water fuel cell is a capacitor too but the problem being its a capacitor that has electrochemical interface in water...

this electochemical interface canot be ignored.. . the double layer capacitance is a function of the dc voltage across the cell being a greater voltage resposible for a greater capacitance since the double layer get compacted.. in the double layer there is a gigantic electric field as the voltage drop is in the interface being maybe 100A.. i remember there is 50kv of electric field there..


this is resposible for a voltage drop of 0.5 v

i have done tests with resonance and high current making the current 90 or so from voltage is possible to have a high current to pass thru water at the minimum possible voltage. in the case were 1.44v fo electodes were steel...

question is that the efficiency was still under 100% since the coil heats a lot and capacitors and the diodes too... although up to 100kw is possible to be there acumulated.. easily.. depends only on the Q factor of the circuit...

100kw mean lot of enegy energy is force...

if we could get the high charge of the gas and coherently discharge it than simply we would be extracting energy out of it...

moving charges inside mean moving charges outside...

if hydrogen is ionized and give up its electron in a region where the potential is low negative it will want to flow to the circuit but it would only do so if the charge of the hydrogen ´proton charge could be discharged elsewhere...


the main problem with applying high voltages to an electrochemical cell is that the electrode attract certain amount of charges to it and above certain voltage this charges are able to readly discharge thu the electrolyte this makes the process of adding high voltage problematic if we apply such slow pulse that can lead to ionic conduction..

if we charge up the cell we create a collection of hydrogen and oxygen at the electrodes... if we short the cells the oxygen and hydrogen will discharge as electricity provided all the requirements..

Meyer describe a way to constantly aplly an increasing force to the molecule... the only way i see of doing it is to let the molecules to atract each other during some steps of the process...

doing tests here and more tests is all i have left...

i´m fascing a severe crisis and will be working  here instaling some air conditioners to make up some money... hope for better days...

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 612
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2016, 01:53:17 am »
Where are you at in your testing? Are you at the point of making gas or at your circuit function or what?

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3634
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2016, 02:05:28 am »
My cell does not generate gas if there is no ppm....in the willing of breaking the bonds i thought this would be the first aproach to go..

but i´m trying also sometimes to put some kinds of different electolytes even tap water but its too dirty

here we have fluoring and chlorine on water also many other deposits... tap water is over 100ppm some times.. sometimes as low as 80ppm

i can deionize to 0ppm on the meter... i need to find a better way to determine how bellow 1ppm it goes

i will probably make a graph to determine from the resistance measurement of the water..

I´m thinking that maybe we could use the current information to determine how fast the curent flow in water such as on copper electons are very slow... water having much lower conductivity would have faster electrons.. this could help to predict the resonant frequency of water cavity..

the only problem is to give some parameters like viscosity of water and relativistic correction..  but i guess knowing the area the distance and the current and volatge is already possible to determine the time it takes for a charge to cross the gap... of course all charge does not need to cross the gap to current for flow there is many charges in series flowing like a snake eatingitself

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3634
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2016, 02:16:49 am »
we we do apply a positive to the plate the oxygen will form at it... the negative side of o2 being attracted to the electrode and dc power supply...

if the power supply is disconnected the oxygen is free to go if the cell is shorted the cell discharge its constituent gases as current... here the oxygen and hydrogen keep atracted to the cell walls...

in my point of view there is something relating here i´m not being able to find...

the main idea is to get gas but if we get e energy is already nice..


« Last Edit: February 12, 2016, 02:34:47 am by sebosfato »

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3634
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2016, 14:28:11 pm »
how is the drift velocity or time important for us if i keep telling that as you take electrons out of one electrode you must add electrons to the other side?

well if we start to create ions with greater than 1 charge it would suffer a greater acceleration...

to create population inversion is required that the molecules arent in thermal equilibrium, it must be disrupted...

the kinetic energy of a molecule is dependent on its mass and velocity.. there are some degrees of freedom also meaning the molecules also casn absorb energy by rotating and stretching vibrating.. this is measured as heat...

when we apply a high voltage to one of the electrodes the electric field would cause ions to move and consequently a current to flow on an external circuit... ions movement as there is a resistance and dielectric constant there create a voltage drop..

if sodium hydroxide is in water it ionizes the water molecules transforming it into free ions.. we can pass a current because at one electrode as oxygen is liberated and sodium try to get plated to the stainless steel, but as its more stable on water it ionize another molecule liberating hydrogen and stay in the solution.. .

there is other like potassium hydroxide that would do the same...

acids would go the other way and the reaction would be at more anodic... correct me if i´m confusing please..

the greater is the number of charge carriers the less is the speed achievable by the ions.. 


 

Offline Login to see usernames

  • Hero member
  • ****
  • Posts: 612
Re: Water fuel cell =
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2016, 23:36:40 pm »
"Resonate frequency 25x the input " into google comes up some stuff you may like to read.
Let it expand your knowledge....may the force be with you :)
« Last Edit: February 13, 2016, 00:03:31 am by KS »