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Projects by members => Projects by members => Sebosfato => Topic started by: sebosfato on April 14, 2016, 02:57:00 am

Title: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 14, 2016, 02:57:00 am
Hello World

I was doing some work into thinking how stanley meyer device works...

i do believe he had something into his theory that allowed he understand how to break the molecules...

when we add an alcaline metal to the water it ionizes the water molecule breaking one of its bounds forming hydroxide ions OH- and making the metal ion "free" in the actually isnot free its hold into a  matrix of water molecules... even distributed on the solution allong with its counter ions...

now what is the advantage of having a metal ion inside water

you are thinking again this ******* brazilian

well metals have more electrons than the water molecule... depending on the atomic number..

this mean that maybe all is required is to have a special electrolyte and electric fields such that the electrolyte work as electrode to the water molecules... like a nanoscale electrode...

in the sense that it can be further ionized in solution liberating more electrons before water start liberating them

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 14, 2016, 03:09:38 am
if we go acid like with a chlorine negative ion than there would be hydrogen atoms in the solution...

the atoms needs to form a diatomic molecule to be able to stabilize... for this it need to share an electron... chlorine is more electonegative than oxygen meaning that it attracts electrons to it so strong that it form a negative ion.. its able to readly ionize water but it can evaporate...

the point realy is meyer said ever said to be using voltage potential to break the molecules

he said that he needed was to restric the amps and achieve electrical resonance

i already proved to myself and others that resonance can accumulate an enourmous amount of energy..using capacitors and thick wire coil.. i even provided some calculation to it... somewhere...

the point is meyer didnt wanted current to flow because it would mean that it would make chemical reaction on the electrodes which he didnt wanted he said he was doing the oposite of electrolysis

he even said that a gate time or pulse off time was need to allow the molecules to get their charge neutralized and get out as gas...

well in my opinion he distributed the capacitance and the electrode into the water... maybe in the form of a oxyde...

an oxide of a metal with many protons would be easier to ionize than water for example liberating the oxygen during pulse on while generating the hydrogen again when reforming the oxide now stealing an oxygen from an water molecule.... this is one example of what i´have study last days...

let me know if it do or not make sense to you

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 15, 2016, 03:16:25 am
i forgot to tell what electrolysis do...

 it createS an environment where the ionized molecules can neutralize liberating  the components...SO ELECTROLYSIS DONT BREAK ANY COVALENT BOND!

the electrolyte is resposible to ionize the molecules... the higher is the ionization state of the ion the higher is the energy but a big atom with low electonegativity results in low secondary ionization energy.

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 15, 2016, 13:27:05 pm
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 15, 2016, 21:06:45 pm
Fabio, whats yr point here?
Meyer used normal water or deminerilised water.
No electrolytes.
So .....
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 16, 2016, 03:08:55 am
Yea im pretty sure water is the ultimate solvant that ionizes the hydroxide not the other way around....its easy to get caught up in all sorts of research during down time but that's ok....pour the juice to it and see how that amp inhibitor thing behaves.
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 16, 2016, 19:36:28 pm
My point is that maybe the electrolyte was already inside the cell so he kind of only needed to add pure water to maintain the concentration of the solution...

I´m kind of thinking that the elecTrOlyte could be further ionized duriNG PUlses....the thing is a solution is stable.... but under high electric fields applied this ions having many electROns may be easier to ionize than water..
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 16, 2016, 22:23:13 pm

Im taking a not sure there are any other special discoveries you may be looking for.
Horvath teaches the ability to use a single post or wire electromagnetic waves with lots of energy...i guess thats the way antennas work too
It seems like you are looking to increase the polarity of the hydroxide ions and maybe if they do and decay may be using the products of the decay of the hydroxide ions to form an attraction of other ions to form a gas....idk.....
Maybe give the slow motion guys a call to film it and take a look to see if any proton tunneling is visable.
Steve Meyers says itsa barrier technology...(whats the barrier )
Maybe a more laymen term would be an interference technolgy....the closer the plates =less interference. ...(whats the interference )
The electrolyte creates less interference /barrier.
Stan said you could use salt water. ...go for it :)
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 16, 2016, 23:31:52 pm
Please dont take my ideas as final i´m just sharing some thoughts i started having because i played with very pure water for a long time and sudenly it didnt seem to be the way to go...

so i looked into horvath patents where he use a nickel electrode and use potassium hydroxide....

the question i started to ask myself was why potassium and not sodium? or other?

the answer i got looking into the periodic table.. potassium is on the left and down so it has a low electronegativity.... its second ionization potential is thereto smaller than sodium for example...

Than drawing the molecules with ions around i recognized that  the ions already stretch the water molecule and actually partial break the bonds.... if forming a hidroxide ion its a water molecule with only one H atom and it even have an extra electron into it... so the covalent bound is already weakened under this conditions...

i´m just sharing that i´m starting to belive that this dissolved ions is the electrode and they react by action of voltage potential.. meaning high voltage fields...

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 17, 2016, 10:01:02 am
Hey Ks i also think that all should try to reply try to add something.. whatever it is. .

i really dont care about having my ideas discussed and even destroyed by arguments it would indeed help me put it away if it dont make sense and focus where should be more important...

i´m here for it,...

Regarding the efficiency of the cell potassium have greater mass than sodium so its a bigger atom.... barium is even heavier than potassium and i have read somewhere it is also a good electrolyte although is a toxic poison...

Title: talking seriously
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 21, 2016, 18:15:34 pm
i believe sometimes that if the water and the gas processor worked in the same circuit that one would be the positive sink for electrons and one the source...

i believe that a negative voltage is directed to the water because fisically this would bring the reaction to be on the cathode... where hydrogen our desired desired product should come from...

in turn this makes the water the sink for electrons in this line of thinking and this electrons must come from a plenty source like a constant flow of air...

so what i mean is that sometimes i think that the vic connects to one cell (isolated) and to the gas processor on the other side... than a choke closes the circuit howerver having a contrary dc voltage applied thru it (choke) the air being pumped out will bring away the positively charged gas and tiheretoo make work doing that.. the result i think would be the water get a very negative charge.... high enough to breakdown..

so like a condenser microphone you need a phanton power to let the electrodes to be charged such that the movent create a detectable signal.. .

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 22, 2016, 08:01:12 am
always talking seriously..

chlorine is more electronegative than oxigen... if we use table salt as electrolyte it will generate h2 and cl2 gas because oxygen forms a hydroxyde....

chlorine is powerful oxidizer....

being more electronegative mean it is a atom with small radius and more protons ... electronigativity is than how much an atom holds electrons to itself... stan said he ionized the ambient gases taking electrons out of it to prevent the formation of water molecule... making it more electronegative than the covalent bound rule... like a ionic much stronger bound... however the temperature and pressure are not favorable for the bound so preventing the formation...

the time a gas will remain ionized is not so long but can get up to maybe 1 second in air...

Title: more of the old same
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 22, 2016, 08:50:01 am
Another thing that is bugging my mind is that a primary coil when pulsed with unipolar pulse will have current to flow aways in one direction...  if a secondary is coupled to it the current in the secondary will go in two directions...

the point really is that when we pulse coil with a mosfet for example the current in the primary will be unidirectional and the secondary will be bidirectional

if now loading the secondary with cells and another coil it follows that on the load coil the current will want to be unidirectional too

of course the voltage will reverse to maintain the direction of the current in it..

however the secondary will also reverse its voltage....

meyer says he use electromagnetic fields to restric the amps.. .

i sometimes think that he mean the reaction of a secondary to a primary... a lorentz reaction like.

when a secondary has a current flowing into a load its actually creating a magnetic field that destroy the magnetic field of the primary such that the primary is hungry for more amps to create more magnetic field..

when the pulse is turned of the secondary magnetic field revert to try keep the magnetic field of the primary the same .....

the magnetic field of the primary is aways unipolar in this view but the secondary have a bipolar nature.. we can say that because actually current go both ways.

so whats the big deal..

meyer show a circuit where he use two chokes...

when we get two coils they can be or not coupled together  if coupled it can be summing or subtracting fields..

another thing that exist is a choke that have a secondary of low voltage with a diode in it ...

i was thinking about if we have a shorted secondary if it will increase or decrease the magnetic forces within the coil..

you see what i mean? maybe a coil wound on copper pipes or steal pipes... because it would create this second magnetic field to interact with the first... and if this portion is of low resistance it will not consume much power but would create high magnetic oposition and helposition..

adding a diode would add dissipation but some control over the colapse

my real question is if we add a diode where the energy of the secondary magnetic field goes?

shoud not it create a superimposed pulse over the "primary" also colapsing pulse? certainly maybe? a double pulse?

in the end i think the whole objective is to be able to pulse this thing and kind of be able to acumulate on the coil enough energy to be able to keep its current flowing in the same direction surpassing the volatge potential of the secondary,,,

if both the chokes are coupled we run in a situation where if the add we simply get voltage divider..

but if they subtract is just as if one coil act as the load for the each other coil.. not sure if its the case.

i think the key is that each choke have its own load ...

Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 22, 2016, 17:38:34 pm
Nobody seem to have noticed the pdf in attachment.. .it talks about meyer missing a presentation...
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 23, 2016, 09:08:07 am
just thought a simple way to determine what would happen.. simply get a primary and secondary,,,,pulse it... look the primary voltage on oscilloscope than short the secondary .. than short thru a diode than revert the diode and analyse what happen to the primary collapse voltage. .

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v 64 240 64 80 0 0 40 50 0 0 0.5
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w 352 192 352 288 0
g 64 240 64 272 0
f 144 368 208 368 0 1.5
w 208 352 208 288 0
r 208 288 208 80 0 220
w 208 80 64 80 0
d 208 384 208 352 1 0.805904783
R 144 368 96 368 0 2 400 10 10 0 0.5
g 208 384 208 400 0
z 256 384 256 336 1 0.805904783 1000
w 256 336 208 288 0
w 256 384 208 384 0
r 384 80 384 144 0 100
w 384 144 352 144 0
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s 352 144 352 192 0 0 false
o 7 64 0 291 1280 6.4 0 -1
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Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 24, 2016, 02:25:31 am
I aways watch again and again and again the newzealand meeting

after doing some tests today i thought about the claims of amp restriction that meyer made...

basically he claimed thru his words that the electrical polarization process could be achieved by a resistance at the expense of pretty much power... saying that using a coil it restrict the amps...

i believe the amp restriction process is dependent on restricting  the amps to allow the voltage fields to be applied to the water... this fieds must be arranged in a certain way that the sequence of voltage pulses can do the work in spliting the molecules...
Title: Re: What electrolysis do?
Post by: Login to see usernames on April 24, 2016, 20:20:17 pm
The back electromotive force that a coil generate to an applied voltage to it is the key to understand the amp restriction mechanism in my mere opinion

i dont think the coil must be resonant at least it seems to me not to be the case to generate hot spikes at whatever frequency...

meyer says voltage do the work lets try to understand that,...

when applying voltage thru the sistem the cell and the coil have a resonance related to its proprieties of spring and mass and this is the electrical resonance of course of this components...

electrical resonance however would inply that the capacitor have to discharge back to keep the concept of resonance that it must accummulate energy over the cycles...

i have many coils here i expect to do lot of tests today...