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Electrolysis => How to make HHO cells more efficient => Topic started by: Steve on July 24, 2010, 13:21:32 pm

Title: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 24, 2010, 13:21:32 pm
How to make HHO cells more efficient.


Its all about increasing the options for the ions and electrons to collide. Besides the electrode space , electrode material, electrode size and type of electrolyte there are more options:

1. Use of RF radiation.
2. Use of Ultra Violet / infrared waves.

Its known as radiolysis. How to implement such a system in our waterfuelcells? The early radio transmitters used a sparkgap for creating radiowaves. We also know that water absorbs waves in the Ultra Violet spectrum. We are lucky. Spark gaps do transmitte radio waves and UV waves!
Now we need to design a cell that is doing basic electrolysis and is using sparks at the same time. It might be even needed to use a 50% duty cycle on both systems, so they don’t interfere with each other.
Meaning: first 50% duty dc on the electrodes and in the off time we create sparks.

The cell can look like this.
 
Steve
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 24, 2010, 13:45:55 pm
http://home.wtal.de/herbs_teslapage/safety.html (http://home.wtal.de/herbs_teslapage/safety.html)
 
The sparkgap produces hard ultraviolet radiation when running just like an arc welder. Avoid looking into the arcs produced by your sparkgap, and if you want to do, use shields for your eyes.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spark_gap (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spark_gap)
 
 
 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 24, 2010, 15:10:18 pm
How about just using a sparkplug and an ignition coil?
 
 
Just some thoughts... 8) 8)
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 00:49:23 am
New version.
I made a mistake with the glas innertube. Glas doesnt let UV thru....argggggg
Need help here!
Does anybody know a tube of plate material that lets UV thru from ~125nm????????

 
 http://www.btinternet.com/~martin.chaplin/vibrat.html (http://www.btinternet.com/~martin.chaplin/vibrat.html)
 
 Absorption of UV close-by (~125 nm), excites the 3a1 orbital (http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/h2oorb.html) leading to dissociation into OH + H (photodissociation; higher energy absorption produces charged fragments [1299 (http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/ref13.html#r1299)]). Such dissociation can also be achieved by consecutive absorption of two 266 nm photons [589 (http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/ref6.html#r589)]. Absorption of two higher energy photons, at 200 nm, gives rise to a hydrated electron by H2O + h? " src="http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/images/reg.gif (http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/images/reg.gif)" width=22 height=10> H2O+ + e-aq
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 05:45:37 am
I think its a wonderful idea , if we can control the freq of this too it would be good for testing .

So we need fast collapse with big inductor to make this efficient , we need high voltage correct ?

1 thing I see hard , shape of cell .
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 10:10:57 am
I think its a wonderful idea , if we can control the freq of this too it would be good for testing .

So we need fast collapse with big inductor to make this efficient , we need high voltage correct ?

1 thing I see hard , shape of cell .

Dankie,
Any sparking device should have some influence....
 
Like: http://wiki.4hv.org/index.php/Flyback (http://wiki.4hv.org/index.php/Flyback)
 
or
 
http://www.powerlabs.org/flybackdriver.htm (http://www.powerlabs.org/flybackdriver.htm)
 
 
I suspect Daniel Dingle of doing a similar thing. There was found a second ignitioncoil in his setup.
 
We can also use your circuit and drive an ignitioncoil. Depending on the voltage applied to the coil, we have to adjust the sparkgap.
If we use sparkplugs as sparkgap, then we can have a very simple but working setup, is it.
 
Now: I NEED A MATERIAL THAT WE CAN USE A PLATE OR TUBE WHICH LET UV THRU FROM ABOUT 125NM.......
Anybody any ideas?
 
 
Steve
 
 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 11:43:39 am
Found some material that comes very close:
 
http://www.escoproducts.com/html/s1-uv_fused_silica.html (http://www.escoproducts.com/html/s1-uv_fused_silica.html)
 
from 180nm it is transmitting UVC thru.
 
A sheet of this glass from like 4 inch by 4 inch by 1mm costs like 230 dollars........
Can anybody donate me some money for this experiment????????
 
 
 
 
 
Steve
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 12:17:56 pm
ACRYLITE OP-1
 
Spectrosil® Quartz    170 through 2700 nm

 
PMMA   285nm to 750nm
 
 

 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 13:34:08 pm
Water absorbing frequency's
 
The blue effect is often increased because  ocean and lake water usually contains floating particles of dirt, and dead and living plants and animals. They help reflect the blue light back upward - so that the lake or ocean looks blue. The blue-green of tropical waters is due entirely to absorption of red light rather then suspension of particles. It's a different blue than the blue of the oceans off the northeast coast, whose blue is caused by suspended particles and plants..
 
 
 
Absorption[/color][/font]Light is absorbed as it passes through the water, and much of it is lost in the process. In addition, the spectral components of light, the wavelengths that give rise to our perception of color, are differentially absorbed. Transmission of light through air does not appreciably change its spectral composition, but transmitting light through water, even through the clearest water, does, and this can change the resulting color appearance beyond recognition. In clearest water, long wavelength or red light is lost first, being absorbed at relatively shallow depths. Orange is filtered out next, followed by yellow, green, and then blue. Other waters, particularly coastal waters, contain silt, decomposing plant and animal material, and plankton and a variety of possible pollutants, which add their specific absorptions to that of the water. Plankton, for example, absorb violets and blues, the colors transmitted best by clear water. The amount of material suspended in some harbor water is frequently sufficient to alter the transmission curve completely; not only is very little light transmitted, but the long wavelengths may be transmitted better than the short, a complete reversal of the situation in clear water.
 
@ all:
 
If the sparks with UV and rf radiation can fill the watermol, then it looks like it would be easier to separate the H and O and will cost less power to do so.
 
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 14:19:52 pm
Water molecules absorb red light weakly and infra-red strongly because the molecules vibrate greatly in the infra-red frequencies. They resonate­that is, they vibrate a greater amount at that frequency like a gong vibrates and "bongs" when hit with a hammer.   The vibrating molecules get hotter due to their motion, like those in a bowl of water warming in the summer's sun.   Occasionally water molecules absorb visible red light. Since the effect is faint, it takes many molecules­about nine feet of water depth--to absorb enough red light so the blue of the water is noticeable. That's why a glass of water looks clear.   
Water is a remarkable substance: it is the only abundant material whose color is due vibrating molecules
Light interacts with electrons to color everything else we see.   
 
The whole water molecule vibrates in three ways: one way like a Mickey Mouse with flapping ears. A water molecule consists of two small atoms of hydrogen arranged in a bent fashion about a larger atom of oxygen. The vibration brings the hydrogen "ears" together and apart. This vibration occurs at the lowest frequency, in the infra-red.
The other two vibrations are twice as energetic and involve a stretching of the bonds holding the oxygen and hydrogen atoms together. Even these vibrations, however, oscillate at heat frequencies below what we see.
 
 
 http://www.wonderquest.com/DeepWaterColors.htm (http://www.wonderquest.com/DeepWaterColors.htm)
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on July 25, 2010, 15:10:09 pm
 
Resonance of the 2 H atoms on top of the O atom is called : bending
This is the Puharich methode....bending and changing the angle of the H atoms on the O atom.
Shifting the bond angle from 104 till 109 degree tetrahedral geometrical configuration.
As far as i understand it, one bond is 104 and the other is 109 and by bending the 104 bonding towards a 109, you will get that tetrahedral shape, which should be easier to break.....?????
Puharich then put the new shaped watermolecule into an injector sparkplug device.....
 
 
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 30, 2012, 09:06:14 am
kinda like ozenated water? mayby bingo gas generator  with stinky ozonated water?
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on June 30, 2012, 10:30:22 am
bingo is with electrolysis with at least one carbon rod, so you get carbon in yr gas. Works great for engines :-)
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on December 26, 2018, 14:05:05 pm
Hi steve remeber this guy

Puharich then put the new shaped watermolecule into an injector sparkplug device.....

well I looked at this then redesigned it as there were some faults  but I came to the conclusion that all the information was not shown the unit that I designed from this at the time was to hard to manufacture  but I wonder  now with all the new machines now available.
 Hydrogen vibrates at 1420.40057Mhz  they were then and I was as well looking at the harmonic frequencies then you need the harmonic frequency of oxygen that is 261.616hz not that high so to get them to vibrate in unison the harmonic is too high for us  3,780,574,537,611.2hz  or 3.780574 Terahz.
Using the high voltage pulsing will end up with arcing between the plates or tubes this arc is at plasma temperatures so is over3,000C so that is why is breaks down the water molecules’
This brings back lots of memories’. 
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on December 26, 2018, 19:23:38 pm
Hi steve remeber this guy

Puharich then put the new shaped watermolecule into an injector sparkplug device.....

well I looked at this then redesigned it as there were some faults  but I came to the conclusion that all the information was not shown the unit that I designed from this at the time was to hard to manufacture  but I wonder  now with all the new machines now available.
 Hydrogen vibrates at 1420.40057Mhz  they were then and I was as well looking at the harmonic frequencies then you need the harmonic frequency of oxygen that is 261.616hz not that high so to get them to vibrate in unison the harmonic is too high for us  3,780,574,537,611.2hz  or 3.780574 Terahz.
Using the high voltage pulsing will end up with arcing between the plates or tubes this arc is at plasma temperatures so is over3,000C so that is why is breaks down the water molecules’
This brings back lots of memories’.

You did a lot of tests, my friend...
Title: Re: RF waves and UV waves improve electrolysis proces
Post by: Login to see usernames on December 27, 2018, 03:04:36 am
yes I did then I got my plasma genertor tested in 2005 now I have to revive it as some interested parties want to ut up some dollars well I have been told that before
we will see