Author Topic: Retry N1001  (Read 2574 times)

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a bit of loose thoughts
« Reply #104 on: July 11, 2018, 10:47:58 am »
If i am alowed to think out of thebox, then again i want to point to the middle of the milar tubular cell with 11 electrode sets in there.
Why did meyer choose a round circle set with a big empty space in thr middle?
Why not a square box?
or why not all 11 much closer to eachother? Make the cell more compact and save money on materials?
I tell you.......the missing component was in the middle of that cell housing....

Maybe a hugh electromagnet?

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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #105 on: July 11, 2018, 10:55:23 am »
maybe a permanent magnet? i like the way you think!

perhaps than we can put a coil outside to combine the fields!!!!

Cool!

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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #106 on: July 11, 2018, 17:36:34 pm »
Heyy

yesterday i wound the chokes it got just right into the EE core....

I started with the thinner coil... it happen that when i went to buy the wire they sold me 21 awg instead of 22awg and so i had to make a small adaption for the turns number.. the 21 awg can get only 53 turns per layer
while the 18 awg can do 34

so i did two layers of 21 awg and 3 layers of 18 awg connected in series with their connection exposed for connecting to the secodnary coil and using a polyester film of 250um between each layers...

this polyester can isolate up to 18kv so its overkill...

 after i made it i started to test with my LC meter and for my surprise it was not working. anymore.. it got damaged from humidity or water so i woke up today very early and decided to try fixing it and i succeeded...

i had to clean the oxidation and soldering again many of the components and substitute a couple of buttons and a resistor...

the pcb of it is very complex with signals going up and down between the layers and some of the problems was this passages... so i had to scratch and solder..

now it finaly works and my chokes seems to have around 95mh with no gap

i highly suggest that you take the lcd off and apply some hot glue to hold the inductor in the LC100 A meter ...befor you run into problems like i did
« Last Edit: July 11, 2018, 18:22:57 pm by sebosfato »

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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #107 on: July 12, 2018, 02:53:09 am »
According to this document perhaps the 22 awg is correct.. in the internet most of the charts for awg dont consider the wire insulation...

this doc in attachment is very good about transformers design take a look

the coils without core measures around 260uH

with only half core 700uh

and with the core around 95 mh

this core has a huge permeability 7200nH/turn +- 25% according to the manual and with a gap of 6mm it become 100nH per turn or 200nH/turn for a 2,5mm gap

according to my calculations perhaps this is aready too big a coil to use but i will start with this as a manner to have adjustments to make

I have think a lot to get to the conclusion and still need to confirm but appear to me that the amps that will saturate the core is calculated based on the inductance the coil will have because this inductance times the current must give a magnetic field (not to be confused with flux that is magnetic field changing)

So if i calculated that it would need for example 100 turns for the primary and that it would saturate at a applied voltage frequency of 170v for example with no gap this transformer would saturate at very low amps.. but increasing the gap is possible to increase the saturation level because the inductance is reduced while the flux stay the same because the voltage frequency area and turns dont change

the higher the gap the lower is the coupling however...

finally i got think i´m starting to understand this

or probably not

kkkk
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 05:37:35 am by sebosfato »

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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #108 on: July 12, 2018, 23:05:18 pm »
I watched some videos on youtube and found a interesting formula co relating the ipeak

its like this

I peak= Ae*n*Bmax/Henries

the core will saturate when the non linked currents arrive to this point


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Re: a bit of loose thoughts
« Reply #109 on: July 12, 2018, 23:10:22 pm »
If i am alowed to think out of thebox, then again i want to point to the middle of the milar tubular cell with 11 electrode sets in there.
Why did meyer choose a round circle set with a big empty space in thr middle?
Why not a square box?
or why not all 11 much closer to eachother? Make the cell more compact and save money on materials?
I tell you.......the missing component was in the middle of that cell housing....

Maybe a hugh electromagnet?

I was thinking about what you say here and it indeed make sense to put a permanent magnet in there to help concentrate the magnetic field on the tubes
however i can tell you this cells should not be made in the way we did it... stan planed to make it using plastic mold injection so there is no loss of material whatever is the design.,.
also the size and distance between electrodes also has to do with power dissipation.. i almost melt mine during tests.. those electrical connections heat a lot when forcing current thru them and melt the plastic that holds it leaking water
the reason its not a box is that is not as simple to make a pressurized container in square shape.. the circular shape holds more pressure...

the best strategy would be to have a small nut soldered to the tube and use a bolt to press the oring againt the tube to increase the connectivity

in one of my cells design i directly added a hole on the tube to the screw is screwed into the tube directly to improve conductivity inside the tube i provided a small disc of acrylic that isolate the part of screw that goes into while have holes to let the water come in


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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #110 on: July 13, 2018, 10:07:50 am »
did anybody had the change to test the metal of those Meyer 11 cell tubes?
was it maybe soft iron with nickel over it?

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Re: Retry N1001
« Reply #111 on: July 13, 2018, 14:36:35 pm »
i think he used stainless steel 304 such as to not allow the material to concentrate the magnetic fields... if it were magnetic the field would be shield by the material

perhaps thats exactly why he chose this material... it wont conduct magnetic material so it allow the fields to be there where the water is...

i think a magnetic material would draw the lines of force to itself

the magnetic fields must be parallel with the electrodes...

maybe the electrodes could be magnets them self!

at new zealand meyer draw some field lines on the capacitor plates that seem voltage equipotential lines but could be magnetic fields parallel with the electrode coudnt it? ???

elsewhere he also draw in this manner...

i believe we found something important understanding this radiation that can be created by accelerating this ions and electrons in this magnetic fields...

perhaps now we could even estimate the required fields to get anything in the range horvath claims

the power circuit i´m designing should be able to finally get 10kv or more across the water even if just for a instant of time 10khz per second

i think with this discharge voltage plus a magnetic field the trick can be done!

i will probably wind a coil around the single cell and check for how much field i can get there... i will maybe use this as a choke for applying dc thru the cell it self going thru the parallel coil to the cell

also i have decided to instead of using the energy of core one at the discharge i will use it for raising the voltage of the cell to high potential (EEC) using high voltage diode connected to the positive dc grounded source.. this will take electrons out of water when there is a high voltage applied to it and wont allow them to return.. . keeping the water charged 

i believe this will cause some equilibrium unbalance at the electrodes charges respective to water... and generate unstable gas

for that i simply will use a thinner wire than planned perhaps 29awg and give enough turns for it to get a nice voltage output maybe the 36 awg wire in the patent was for this!

« Last Edit: July 13, 2018, 22:02:32 pm by sebosfato »