Author Topic: Working resonance circuit  (Read 28081 times)

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #32 on: December 14, 2009, 22:44:38 pm »
I mean in parallel because of the current... you could use mosfets internal diodes too aways on condition.

Is a resonant circuit you are right.

A resonant circuit develops high voltage accordingly to the recirculating current multiplied by the inductive reactance. Thats why stan said '' i'm going to use 4 amps, big deal'' where about power consumption he was giving us the parameters of the circuit because he said 40 watts so you have a series resistance of about 2,5 because 4^2 =16*2,5= 40 watts this is the dissipated power on the coils and capacitors and also water itself . He also repeat continuously restrict amps and let the voltage take over in a dead short condition. Isn't it the same as A resonant circuit develops high voltage accordingly to the recirculating current multiplied by the inductive reactance.  Lets say one have at 10khz an impedance of 10.000 and have 4 amps recirculating you will have 40kv or about 160kwatts of recirculating power. If the series resistance is = to 2,5 you are consuming only 40 watts. With no losses on transistor and the transformer and internal losses of the battery. So you can say if you got about 90% efficient input circuit you will consume about 45watts.

 
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 23:07:59 pm by sebosfato »

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #33 on: December 14, 2009, 23:07:56 pm »
how would there be any resonance in steve's circuit? which impedances would match? i calculated it through a few times, always without plausible results.

XL of the left path == (XL + Xc) of the right path?
that's never the case

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #34 on: December 15, 2009, 11:59:34 am »
Hi all,

I will reply to you all, as soon as i  find a moment.....My job is eating all my time at the moment.

Steve

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #35 on: December 16, 2009, 12:52:32 pm »
Here a circuit simulator example of the first circuit, as stevie said i did disregard the tube-capacitor.

$ 1 5.0E-6 10.20027730826997 50 5.0 50
R 80 192 80 256 0 0 40.0 12.0 0.0 0.0 0.5
w 80 192 80 32 0
w 80 32 400 32 0
w 400 32 400 64 0
w 400 64 320 64 0
w 400 64 480 64 0
w 480 64 480 80 0
w 320 64 320 80 0
l 320 80 320 256 0 0.0024 0.08272617691301952
l 480 80 480 144 0 0.0024 -0.08272525742922969
c 480 144 480 208 0 4.7E-8 -8.165649264514485
w 320 256 320 304 0
w 320 304 480 304 0
R 272 336 224 336 0 2 10000.0 12.0 0.0 0.0 0.5
w 272 336 352 336 0
f 384 352 448 352 0 1.5
w 448 336 480 304 0
w 384 352 352 336 0
g 448 368 448 400 0
r 480 208 528 208 0 5.0
r 560 208 592 208 0 5.0
w 592 208 640 208 0
w 640 208 640 304 0
w 640 304 480 304 0
d 528 208 528 160 1 0.805904783
w 528 160 592 160 0
w 592 160 592 208 0
w 560 208 560 256 0
d 560 256 480 256 1 0.805904783
w 480 256 480 208 0


the resistor values and frequency is not steves. maybe it helps someone to see it all clearly drawn with the components.

Its more like this. You will get 132volts AC across the capacitor.

$ 1 5.0E-6 0.20306040966347483 71 5.0 50
R 32 208 32 272 0 0 40.0 12.0 0.0 0.0 0.5
w 32 208 32 48 0
w 32 48 352 48 0
w 352 48 352 80 0
w 352 80 272 80 0
w 352 80 432 80 0
w 432 80 432 96 0
w 272 80 272 96 0
l 272 96 272 272 0 0.0024 0.2271882621204687
l 432 96 432 160 0 0.0024 0.19853182203672715
c 432 160 432 224 0 8.3E-8 128.49189556108044
w 272 272 272 320 0
w 272 320 432 320 0
R 224 352 176 352 0 2 10000.0 12.0 0.0 0.0 0.5
w 224 352 304 352 0
f 336 368 400 368 0 1.5
w 400 352 432 320 0
w 336 368 304 352 0
g 400 384 400 416 0
r 432 224 480 224 0 5.0
r 512 224 544 224 0 5.0
w 544 224 592 224 0
w 592 224 592 320 0
w 592 320 432 320 0
d 480 224 480 176 1 0.805904783
w 480 176 544 176 0
w 544 176 544 224 0
w 512 224 512 272 0
d 512 272 432 272 1 0.805904783
w 432 272 432 224 0
o 10 1 0 35 160.0 0.8 0 -1

Simulator:
http://www.ionizationx.com/circuit/index.html

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2009, 13:00:39 pm »
Hey Steve,
are you thinking now of building a adjustable plates cell? Make smaller gap (lower resistance), then you would have more volts I guess. ::)  Or build a bigger HV power-supply (more current used).

More questions:
What's your gap-size right now, are the two tubes identical ?
How many amps are you consuming (in mAmps range...) ?
Are you seeing more,less or the same gas production, when electrolysis with same amps is used?

Thanks!

br,
Webmug

I have a gap of 1.5mm between my tubes.
The 2 tubessets are identical.
Webmug, i am not gonna make a variable cell. Stan writes about small tubes of 3 inches, and those i use.

The results is gas production is expected.
The results with this setup depends on the current flowing thru the tubes.
If we can get amps circulated, like Sebos is doing, you will gain more gas.

My circuit is the start of something new. Of course its not finished, yet.
If we all make a replication of this and develop it futher, we might get a very nice performing system with lots of gas and less input power.

Steve

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #37 on: December 16, 2009, 13:01:58 pm »
Hi steve,

what is the sine wave amplitude on the capacitor when you are having 120v accross each cell?


The sinewave across the cap is 2 times the voltage across one tubeset.
240volts to be excact.

Steve

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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #38 on: December 16, 2009, 13:11:06 pm »
steve,

your second drawing with the idea of a vic incorperated...   im looking at maybe a different approach for the power supply and pulsing..

im looking to use a variac powering a vic supplying the chokes...  stan shows the use of a scr on the positive side of the supply..    and he connect strait to ground... i know  we have spoke about the scr not being able to turn off when being applied to chokes, but what about the scr being applied to a vic...would the charging of the toroidal reach a point where current stops in the primary? due to the fact that this circuit is condensing electrons to the back side of d4... then since you use the coil to build a isolated load then once the scr switches off the toroid will collapse and provide a pulse to the circuit.??

The use of a SCR is the same as using a sold state relais, or FET or transistor.
You have to know how to switch it on and off. Thats the whole idea of creating pulses. There is no magic is the choice of components, as far as i have seen the last couple of years.
Stan used the variac with scr to create a pulsed half rectified signal. I have seen it, because i replicated that 2 years ago. Because resonance is independed on voltage level, it doesnt matter if your voltage is fluctuating.

Every coil will stop pulling amps as soon as it is saturated. That means also for the primairy coil of a VIC.
Whats left is the resistance of that coil against the powersupply. You will notic a high amp peak of charging the coil and then it will level out.

Steve







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Re: Working resonance circuit
« Reply #39 on: December 16, 2009, 13:16:38 pm »
I actually have all components except the diodes. 0,1µF 1000V cap, bifilar 1,16mH coil, tubes probably.
Since i'd be very surprised if steve's little coils would survive more than a few watts i guess it's save to use 1000V/1A diodes?

did you use a sine wave or square wave?

also excel sheet for calculation with circuit 1. adjust orange boxes.

My values of the components are very hugh. You do not need that.
Start small. Get it to work.
My circuit pulled 12v by 1 amps.

Important: use 2 coils on 1 core.

Yes, i used a 50% squarewave

Steve